<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Char:</div><div class="quote_post">Salim Stoudamire. After a few games, he'll start torchin' fools.</div> the 6'1 SG, how many minutes is he even going to get on the team?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting og15:</div><div class="quote_post"> the 6'1 SG, how many minutes is he even going to get on the team?</div> Definetly more than Marvin Williams, he has better chance than Marvin Williams at getting the ROY award. Salim will probably come straight in, and play PG for the Hawks cuz they don't have any one else, so they should just start him. He'll give them at least 10 point a night, that will almost be their leading scorer The Hawks don't have a log Jam at PG and SG like they do at SF. So he will torch some ppl, but get packed too.
I guess Stoudemire is a legitamate choice, as long as the Hawks don't pick anyone up in the off-season at PG. He will have the oppurtunity to play the 1 and 2, and rack up his points and assists... Depending on how he fairs in the NBA game his stats can be varied big time.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr.Wade:</div><div class="quote_post">No VC, I have no anger from the Raps forum debate... there's no need for any anger. I don't keep grudges. Why would have anger from the Raps forum? I was just saying that you basically took a shot at Canadians, as if I represent the whole Canadian population that's it. I guess I'm now Mr. Canada.</div> Good to hear, and the Canada thing was a joke. I just wanted to see how you'd take it. I apologize for jokes and sarcasm in this thread. I suppose they're not everyone's cup of tea. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Bogut will get stats, but not as much as some think, maybe 14 and 8.</div> I don't know what leads you to believe that he'll only get fourteen points per game next season. Ben Gordon came off the bench in Chicago and got fourteen points per game, and Dwight Howard almost put up fourteen points per game as an eighteen year old rookie on a team with Steve Francis, Grant Hill, and Cuttino Mobley. I know you personally have most likely seen Bogut play in the NCAA, so after seeing how he can dominate a game offensively, why would you think he'd get anything short of fifteen points per game on a team where he's set to be the first or second option (sorry og, Dez is talented, but I just see Bogut as a bigger offensive threat)? While eight rebounds is on the low side, I think that could end up being realistic. I could see his rebounding number being anywhere from eight to eleven rebounds per game. I think a lot of it hinges on resigning Dan Gadzuric to be honest. Anyway, I think Salim Stoudamire should be ROY. (Oh damn, I said I'd stop with the sarcasm.)
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I apologize for jokes and sarcasm in this thread. I suppose they're not everyone's cup of tea. I don't know what leads you to believe that he'll only get fourteen points per game next season. Ben Gordon came off the bench in Chicago and got fourteen points per game, and Dwight Howard almost put up fourteen points per game as an eighteen year old rookie on a team with Steve Francis, Grant Hill, and Cuttino Mobley. I know you personally have most likely seen Bogut play in the NCAA, so after seeing how he can dominate a game offensively, why would you think he'd get anything short of fifteen points per game on a team where he's set to be the first or second option (sorry og, Dez is talented, but I just see Bogut as a bigger offensive threat)? While eight rebounds is on the low side, I think that could end up being realistic. I could see his rebounding number being anywhere from eight to eleven rebounds per game. I think a lot of it hinges on resigning Dan Gadzuric to be honest. Anyway, I think Salim Stoudamire should be ROY. (Oh damn, I said I'd stop with the sarcasm.)</div> No, I can take jokes and sarcasm, maybe I see you as being more serious than you actually are. I guess I can lighten up sorry Voodoo. My apologies Mr. Mod. And about Bogut... I don't see him being as big of an offensive threat as D-Mase who averaged what, 18 ppg last season? Also, Dwight didn't come THAT close to averaging 14 points, I mean if you can stretch it he did. He averaged 12. Bogut will be expected to pass out of the post imo, to the newly resigned Michael Redd. I can see Bogut getting around 4.5 apg, along with 9.5 boards and 14 points.
I got some back up, ^ Still Desmond Mason is going to get more points than Bogut, and with Redd back scoring 40 points a game, Bogut won't be able to do much( Redd seemed like he had 40 every night last year) Bogut did good in the college level, but he will have some wear and tear on his body, going against Shaq, Ilgauskas, and whoever else he goes up against, it's at least 3 games a week in the NBA, that's AT LEAST. Deron Williams won't have to go against Shaq and Ilgauskas, he will go up against Bibby and Telafair type players, not full grown men who are 7-foot and weigh well over 300 pounds. Plus he's going blind in 1 eye, won't be able to see straight. As Mr. Wade calls you, Mr. Mod, think bout that.
J_Ray, you fail to mention that Deron Williams will go up against Tony Parker, Andre Miller, Sam Cassell, Steve Nash, Baron Davis, and Jason Williams as well. These are seasoned veterans that will pick Williams' pocket easily if he makes the littlest mistake. I don't understand what you mean that he'll be going to against 7 foot guys that are 300 pounds. Only guy that I can think of that is that big is Shaq. And there is no one in the league that stop him. So we all know that Bogut will have trouble when he goes up against Shaq as does every center. Bogut has already played against some of the NBA's best overseas in the Olympics last season where he averaged 14 pts, 8 boards, 1 block. So please don't give me that BS that he won't be able to go up against the "big boys." og15, I couldn't agree more about starting Lue over Salim. Salim will get killed if he comes right in and starts at PG after playing mostly SG at Arizona.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting UKOwnstheSEC:</div><div class="quote_post">J_Ray, you fail to mention that Deron Williams will go up against Tony Parker, Andre Miller, Sam Cassell, Steve Nash, Baron Davis, and Jason Williams as well. These are seasoned veterans that will pick Williams' pocket easily if he makes the littlest mistake. I don't understand what you mean that he'll be going to against 7 foot guys that are 300 pounds. Only guy that I can think of that is that big is Shaq. And there is no one in the league that stop him. So we all know that Bogut will have trouble when he goes up against Shaq as does every center. Bogut has already played against some of the NBA's best overseas in the Olympics last season where he averaged 14 pts, 8 boards, 1 block. So please don't give me that BS that he won't be able to go up against the "big boys." og15, I couldn't agree more about starting Lue over Salim. Salim will get killed if he comes right in and starts at PG after playing mostly SG at Arizona.</div> UK, The reason I didn't mention those guys is because I was trying to keep my boat above the water, and you have just now sunk it, lol . I thought you were on my side. You guys keep saying that Bogut went over seas and played big competition, but you guys have failed to say Deron Williams has too. Deron Williams is more experienced than you give him, after all, he did lead his team pass Michigan St. 3 teams this year I believe . He can also score when he needs, he showed that against Arizona if you forgot (I wish I forgot). Any ways, I'm starting my D-Will for ROY maybe even MVP(like my Joking VC ) Campaign!!!!! <div align="center"> D-Will for ROY </div>
I'm not on anyone's side. I'm just voicing my opinion on why I feel Bogut will win rookie of the year. By the way, you care to give the link that shows how well Deron Williams played overseas.
It was a couple of years ago, he was on the junior team coached by Coach K, and he was a starter, they were talking about it during a Illinois game on CBS last year and this year. Trust me!!!
I'm not taking anyone's side as well, I'm just saying as an NBA Center, there is MUCH more wear and tear affected on your body than an NBA point guard. We all know Bogut is NBA ready, but there is still the wear and tear that every player must cope with playing 82 games a year as a big man, and banging, playing 30 something minutes a night is tough.
I do think Deron Williams can average 6-7 APG though depending on his minutes. I think him, Felton, and Paul, are all capable of putting up assist numbers in that range. I know Voodoo posted the numbers for PG's last year and all, but that is only one year, and the trends don't continue. If you look at 2 years ago, TJ Ford averaged 6.5 APG in 25 or so MPG, and Hinrich 6.8 APG in 36 or so MPG. I don't think any of these guys are currently as good playmakers as Ford was, though not far, but I feel they are as good or maybe better than Hinrich. So if they can get 30+ MPG, they're definately capable of putting up 6+ APG. Also with Desmond Mason, I do feel that Bogut is a better offensive weapon, and in the second half of the season will be a bigger focus, but Desmond Mason is still a capable scorer, and he will be scoring more and getting more shots than Bogut. The scoring will go something like Redd: 21-23 PPG, Mason: 15-17 PPG, Bogut: 14-16 PPG. Considering Bogut will likely be scoring at a higher efficiency then Mason, it will take less shots for him to get his 14-16. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Bogut will be expected to pass out of the post imo, to the newly resigned Michael Redd. I can see Bogut getting around 4.5 apg, along with 9.5 boards and 14 points.</div> That's a very high assist amount, you need to be a playmaker, and more than just a guy passing out of the post to get that high amount of assists. They'd have to run an offense like Sacremento does with their big men for Bogut to be able to do that. A lot of people always think if you have an outside shooter, they can just feed off the big man all day, but teams will not be doubling off Redd's man. While Redd is a shooter, he needs to have off ball plays ran for him, like Reggie, Rip, Ray etc, and in those situations, the PG is the one who get's the assists.
^ Yes, I guess I overexagerated on the assists per game count. I was thinking of comparing him to Miller and Dviac and their assists per game count. I do think however, Bogut could get those assists numbers if they ran plays for him, as he is a capable enough passer to be getting high assist numbers...
