<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kdub @ Jul 24 2008, 03:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I... like it. Why can Simmons be traded, is it because it's a straight up swap?</div> Yup. Simmons for Noc and the rest for Hughes.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 03:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>because getting the eighth seed hurts in the long run with the draft. I personally say lose and rebuild unless they are serious about a championship or a deep run in the playoffs. I would like if the Nets were like Philly. Go through a year of rebuilding (as Philly did) and than make a run at the playoffs the next year and the third year sign a big name free agent to make the commitment about being a serious championship contender. Hughes and Nocioni are not the answers to even making the playoffs. The Nets will still have a hard time. look the East is so much improved this year with Toronto get Jermaine and Philly getting Brand. Hughes and Nocioni wouldn't even get them to the playoffs. So I say if you want to make the playoffs this year go and get Josh Smith or Ron Artest. If you don't do that than just rebuild this year, get a high draft pick and win in 2009.</div> Well, I understand the lose so you can get a high draft pick philosphy... just say that next time. Personally I can't see rooting a team to lose, but it's definitely another approach. </div> Because you have to learn that its not really rooting for a team to lose its rather watching them develop and giving young guys expierence. You can't just keep trading and i signing old veterans and hope they will make you win. Just look at the Knicks, I know this is different because its shorter contracts but rebuilding is part of the game. I know many fans don't like it but every team has to go through it once their franchise player leaves. For the Knicks once Houston got injured they should of started to rebuild, for the Phillies- rebuilded after A.I left, for the Timberwolves- rebuilding after KG, Jazz rebuilding for a year after Malone left. the Nets are now rebuilding after they lost Kidd. Trust me its best for the franchise. If you delay it, it can put your Franchise in a hole.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 04:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 03:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>because getting the eighth seed hurts in the long run with the draft. I personally say lose and rebuild unless they are serious about a championship or a deep run in the playoffs. I would like if the Nets were like Philly. Go through a year of rebuilding (as Philly did) and than make a run at the playoffs the next year and the third year sign a big name free agent to make the commitment about being a serious championship contender. Hughes and Nocioni are not the answers to even making the playoffs. The Nets will still have a hard time. look the East is so much improved this year with Toronto get Jermaine and Philly getting Brand. Hughes and Nocioni wouldn't even get them to the playoffs. So I say if you want to make the playoffs this year go and get Josh Smith or Ron Artest. If you don't do that than just rebuild this year, get a high draft pick and win in 2009.</div> Well, I understand the lose so you can get a high draft pick philosphy... just say that next time. Personally I can't see rooting a team to lose, but it's definitely another approach. </div> Because you have to learn that its not really rooting for a team to lose its rather watching them develop and giving young guys expierence. You can't just keep trading and i signing old veterans and hope they will make you win. Just look at the Knicks, I know this is different because its shorter contracts but rebuilding is part of the game. I know many fans don't like it but every team has to go through it once their franchise player leaves. For the Knicks once Houston got injured they should of started to rebuild, for the Phillies- rebuilded after A.I left, for the Timberwolves- rebuilding after KG, Jazz rebuilding for a year after Malone left. the Nets are now rebuilding after they lost Kidd. Trust me its best for the franchise. If you delay it, it can put your Franchise in a hole. </div> I'm on your side. The Nets have all of these young guys and I'd like to see them play a lot of minutes. Just like Krstic's rookie season, I want to see Williams and Lopez play enough minutes every game to foul out.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 04:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 03:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'> Well, I understand the lose so you can get a high draft pick philosphy... just say that next time. Personally I can't see rooting a team to lose, but it's definitely another approach.</div> Because you have to learn that its not really rooting for a team to lose its rather watching them develop and giving young guys expierence. You can't just keep trading and i signing old veterans and hope they will make you win. Just look at the Knicks, I know this is different because its shorter contracts but rebuilding is part of the game. I know many fans don't like it but every team has to go through it once their franchise player leaves. For the Knicks once Houston got injured they should of started to rebuild, for the Phillies- rebuilded after A.I left, for the Timberwolves- rebuilding after KG, Jazz rebuilding for a year after Malone left. the Nets are now rebuilding after they lost Kidd. Trust me its best for the franchise. If you delay it, it can put your Franchise in a hole. </div> I have to learn? You have your views on how to develop players and I have mine. Let's leave it at that.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Jul 24 2008, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm on your side. The Nets have all of these young guys and I'd like to see them play a lot of minutes. Just like Krstic's rookie season, I want to see Williams and Lopez play enough minutes every game to foul out.</div> Well you better hope they trade Boone and Najera because between those 2 and Yi I don't see Williams getting a lot of minutes. Lopez will. I think he'll back up Boone and replace him at center before the season ends. What I'm suggesting really has no impact on the power rotation. It's just to strengthen the 2 and 3 spots without hurting the teams flexibility in 2010.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Jul 24 2008, 01:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 04:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 03:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>because getting the eighth seed hurts in the long run with the draft. I personally say lose and rebuild unless they are serious about a championship or a deep run in the playoffs. I would like if the Nets were like Philly. Go through a year of rebuilding (as Philly did) and than make a run at the playoffs the next year and the third year sign a big name free agent to make the commitment about being a serious championship contender. Hughes and Nocioni are not the answers to even making the playoffs. The Nets will still have a hard time. look the East is so much improved this year with Toronto get Jermaine and Philly getting Brand. Hughes and Nocioni wouldn't even get them to the playoffs. So I say if you want to make the playoffs this year go and get Josh Smith or Ron Artest. If you don't do that than just rebuild this year, get a high draft pick and win in 2009.</div> Well, I understand the lose so you can get a high draft pick philosphy... just say that next time. Personally I can't see rooting a team to lose, but it's definitely another approach. </div> Because you have to learn that its not really rooting for a team to lose its rather watching them develop and giving young guys expierence. You can't just keep trading and i signing old veterans and hope they will make you win. Just look at the Knicks, I know this is different because its shorter contracts but rebuilding is part of the game. I know many fans don't like it but every team has to go through it once their franchise player leaves. For the Knicks once Houston got injured they should of started to rebuild, for the Phillies- rebuilded after A.I left, for the Timberwolves- rebuilding after KG, Jazz rebuilding for a year after Malone left. the Nets are now rebuilding after they lost Kidd. Trust me its best for the franchise. If you delay it, it can put your Franchise in a hole. </div> I'm on your side. The Nets have all of these young guys and I'd like to see them play a lot of minutes. Just like Krstic's rookie season, I want to see Williams and Lopez play enough minutes every game to foul out. </div> What are you going to do for the rest of Q1, and then Q2+Q3+Q4?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 04:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Jul 24 2008, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm on your side. The Nets have all of these young guys and I'd like to see them play a lot of minutes. Just like Krstic's rookie season, I want to see Williams and Lopez play enough minutes every game to foul out.</div> Well you better hope they trade Boone and Najera because between those 2 and Yi I don't see Williams getting a lot of minutes. Lopez will. I think he'll back up Boone and replace him at center before the season ends. </div> You are overestimating how long it would take for them to foul out. Besides, I've already stated my opinion on trading Boone link
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ Jul 24 2008, 04:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What are you going to do for the rest of Q1, and then Q2+Q3+Q4?</div> Play the other guys on the roster
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 04:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 03:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'> Well, I understand the lose so you can get a high draft pick philosphy... just say that next time. Personally I can't see rooting a team to lose, but it's definitely another approach.</div> Because you have to learn that its not really rooting for a team to lose its rather watching them develop and giving young guys expierence. You can't just keep trading and i signing old veterans and hope they will make you win. Just look at the Knicks, I know this is different because its shorter contracts but rebuilding is part of the game. I know many fans don't like it but every team has to go through it once their franchise player leaves. For the Knicks once Houston got injured they should of started to rebuild, for the Phillies- rebuilded after A.I left, for the Timberwolves- rebuilding after KG, Jazz rebuilding for a year after Malone left. the Nets are now rebuilding after they lost Kidd. Trust me its best for the franchise. If you delay it, it can put your Franchise in a hole. </div> I have to learn? You have your views on how to develop players and I have mine. Let's leave it at that. </div> So your saying your view on developing players is keeping them on the bench while trading for washed up veterans and giving them 20-30 mins on a below average team? The Nets have a lot of young guys and its going to be hard to develop them if they gain no expierence. That's a fact not a view. You can't have it both ways. Either be like Boston and go out and trade your young guys for superstars or be like Philedellphia or Toronto who took time to develop their young players. Hey Listen the Nets already said their rebuilding. They all said it Ratner, Thorn and Frank. It's a process, one year of rebuilding thats it. We all seen the Nets lose, one more year I'm sure we can all take it and bro we'll allowed to have diferent views if you don't want to talk about it its all good but thats what forums are for
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Jul 24 2008, 04:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 04:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Jul 24 2008, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm on your side. The Nets have all of these young guys and I'd like to see them play a lot of minutes. Just like Krstic's rookie season, I want to see Williams and Lopez play enough minutes every game to foul out.</div> Well you better hope they trade Boone and Najera because between those 2 and Yi I don't see Williams getting a lot of minutes. Lopez will. I think he'll back up Boone and replace him at center before the season ends. </div> You are overestimating how long it would take for them to foul out. Besides, I've already stated my opinion on trading Boone link </div> I'm not against trading Boone, but does that mean you start Lopez at center with Williams backing him up? The other option is to just send Williams to the D-League. Have him start down there for a couple months. Guy needs to play, but he's a liability out there now. He's a fouling machine that is always out of position and doesn't grab a lot of boards.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 04:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>So your saying your view on developing players is keeping them on the bench while trading for washed up veterans and giving them 20-30 mins on a below average team? The Nets have a lot of young guys and its going to be hard to develop them if they gain no expierence. That's a fact not a view. You can't have it both ways. Either be like Boston and go out and trade your young guys for superstars or be like Philedellphia or Toronto who took time to develop their young players. Hey Listen the Nets already said their rebuilding. They all said it Ratner, Thorn and Frank. It's a process, one year of rebuilding thats it. We all seen the Nets lose, one more year I'm sure we can all take it and bro we'll allowed to have diferent views if you don't want to talk about it its all good but thats what forums are for</div> Go look at my depth chart again. I have Yi starting, Lopez at back-up center and CDR backing up Nocioni. That's not buried on the bench. This trade has little effect on the young guys. It's replacing Simmons with Nocioni and getting a veteran SG to back-up Carter, which is what Thorn and Kiki are looking to do anyway. The log jam is in the power rotation. This trade has no impact there. Me and a lot of other people don't think these 2 are washed up veterans. Especially Nocioni. My view on developing players is to have them learn the right way from quality veterans rather than to throw them out there like a bunch of puppies and hope they figure out how to sit and heal on their own. And BTW, Hughes is 29 and Nocioni 28. They are not old veterans. Darrell Armstrong and Kurt Thomas are old vets. And also, people have a distorted view of Philly's rebuild. Their worst season was 2006-07 and they were 35-47. One win better than the Nets last season. And their highest draft pick in the past 3 years was Thadeus Young last summer at #12. They didn't completely tear it down.
i kno that nocioni is not washed up... he had an injury a couple years ago... but he has still been very productive... and hes a fighter... he does the dirty work for the team... willin to dive on the floor, willin to commit the hard foul... we dont have a player like that... hughes would be a great addition to us... in cleveland he just didnt fit... guess something wasnt rite... but hughes was always a talent... so id love for this trade to happen... side note... JOSH SMITH still my #1 choice just FYI netted
It was reported Monday that Deng gave the Bulls 2 weeks to figure things out. Probably until next Friday. Next week will be interesting. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>LAS VEGAS (TICKER) —Luol Deng and the Chicago Bulls are on course for divorce, according to a report from Yahoo! Sports. The restricted free agent forward has given the Bulls two weeks to come to a contract agreement or else he will leave the team as a free agent after the upcoming season, the report said. The 6-9 Deng is scheduled to join the Great Britain national team, hence the deadline. If the Bulls fail to sign Deng, 23, to a long-term deal he will take a one-year qualifying offer for $4.5 million and test free agency after the season, according to Yahoo! In 63 games last season, Deng averaged 17 points and 6.3 rebounds.</div> Link
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (danxcr @ Jul 24 2008, 04:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>i kno that nocioni is not washed up... he had an injury a couple years ago... but he has still been very productive... and hes a fighter... he does the dirty work for the team... willin to dive on the floor, willin to commit the hard foul... we dont have a player like that... hughes would be a great addition to us... in cleveland he just didnt fit... guess something wasnt rite... but hughes was always a talent... so id love for this trade to happen... side note... JOSH SMITH still my #1 choice just FYI netted </div> Nocioni is not washed up, I was directing my attacks more at Hughes, but still how much more production will Nocioni give us than Simmons? You guys are giving up on Simmons already even though hes never even played a single game with the Nets. Hes just like Nareja in terms of dirty work so we do have a player like that. Simmons is a good solid player and I believe in him thats why I don't see why we need Nocioni especially after we acquired Nareja and Hayes. In terms of production Nocioni has never really jumped out at me. I know he does a lot of things that don't show up in the box score but he has a long contract and to be that committed to a player of his caliber is really not worth IMO. just my opion guys
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 06:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>It was reported Monday that Deng gave the Bulls 2 weeks to figure things out. Probably until next Friday. Next week will be interesting. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>LAS VEGAS (TICKER) ?€”Luol Deng and the Chicago Bulls are on course for divorce, according to a report from Yahoo! Sports. The restricted free agent forward has given the Bulls two weeks to come to a contract agreement or else he will leave the team as a free agent after the upcoming season, the report said. The 6-9 Deng is scheduled to join the Great Britain national team, hence the deadline. If the Bulls fail to sign Deng, 23, to a long-term deal he will take a one-year qualifying offer for $4.5 million and test free agency after the season, according to Yahoo! In 63 games last season, Deng averaged 17 points and 6.3 rebounds.</div> Link </div> Wow who would of thought Deng has some great britain in him
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 06:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Nocioni is not washed up, I was directing my attacks more at Hughes, but still how much more production will Nocioni give us than Simmons? You guys are giving up on Simmons already even though hes never even played a single game with the Nets. Hes just like Nareja in terms of dirty work so we do have a player like that. Simmons is a good solid player and I believe in him thats why I don't see why we need Nocioni especially after we acquired Nareja and Hayes. In terms of production Nocioni has never really jumped out at me. I know he does a lot of things that don't show up in the box score but he has a long contract and to be that committed to a player of his caliber is really not worth IMO. just my opion guys</div> There are questions surrounding Simmons return from the injuries. He maybe fine. I won't be upset if we keep him. I just see this as an upgrade that has little negative impact on the Nets long term plans. I don't see Simmons, Hayes, or Hassell as a clear cut answer at starting SF. I think Nocioni is. I'd love Simmons as a back-up SF, but I rather see CDR get those minutes. Once Nocioni is the starter then it leaves Hayes and CDR to duke it out for the back-up spot and I think CDR wins that battle. Hughes is just back-up 2 guard, which he'll be better at then being the #2 guy in Cleveland. If Carter goes down we only have Dooling with enough mobility to defend 2 guards. I think Hughes is better than Kareem Rush, and I like Kareem. And don't forget Hughes had his best season under Eddie Jordan in Washington. Frank uses some of the same concepts in his offense.
Interesting read on Hughes. Was on ESPN just before the draft. Seems he's still struggling a bit with his brother's death. Riding with ... Larry Hughes He's a little pricey, but he comes off the books in 2010. In the end it's only a little more than Simmons would make.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 06:09 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 06:05 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>It was reported Monday that Deng gave the Bulls 2 weeks to figure things out. Probably until next Friday. Next week will be interesting. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>LAS VEGAS (TICKER) �?‚??€?Luol Deng and the Chicago Bulls are on course for divorce, according to a report from Yahoo! Sports. The restricted free agent forward has given the Bulls two weeks to come to a contract agreement or else he will leave the team as a free agent after the upcoming season, the report said. The 6-9 Deng is scheduled to join the Great Britain national team, hence the deadline. If the Bulls fail to sign Deng, 23, to a long-term deal he will take a one-year qualifying offer for $4.5 million and test free agency after the season, according to Yahoo! In 63 games last season, Deng averaged 17 points and 6.3 rebounds.</div> Link </div> Wow who would of thought Deng has some great britain in him </div>A decent amount of people since he was a NJ HS phenom.. and he doesn't have Great Britain in him. He's Sudanese.
Netted, my fundamental disagreement with your plan is your contention that Noc can be a full time starter at SF. That makes the entire plan flawed to me.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Jul 24 2008, 06:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Netted, my fundamental disagreement with your plan is your contention that Noc can be a full time starter at SF. That makes the entire plan flawed to me.</div> You believe he can be counted on for at least 20 mpg. What's the difference if he starts? I'd rather have Hughes mainly back-up VC and be a 6th man. However, there is flexibility with this group for different line-ups.
