Official LeBron to the Bulls thread

Your whole argument is Fail

If you have found stats that show Lebron is better than Jordan, certainly the same stats can show who the greatest retired players are in order, right? Because you think stats show all.

I've asked, asked and asked for this list and per your link above, you pull out some inner circle crap that doesn't even rank players. And doesn't even know Karl Malone never got a ring.

Let's see the list. If you can't produce a list, then it's pretty clear that you cherry picked some advance stats. Talk about subjective.

 

Just for fun. Let's look at this with stats only.

For combined seasons, in the regular season, from 1946-47 to 2009-10, from age 21 to 25, requiring Player Efficiency Rating >= 22 and Minutes Played >= 300

Jordan #1 in PER at 29.6
Lebron #4 in PER at 28.8

Jordan is better in the playoffs, too

http://www.basketball-reference.com...tat=dws&c4comp=gt&c4val=.1&order_by=ws_per_48

For combined seasons, in the playoffs, from 1946-47 to 2009-10, from age 21 to 25, sorted by descending Win Shares Per 48 Minutes. and Minutes Played >= 300

Jordan #6, Lebron #11

For combined seasons, in the regular season, from 1946-47 to 2009-10, from age 21 to 25, sorted by descending Win Shares Per 48 Minutes.

Jordan #3, Lebron #5.

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Aparrently the two most important metrics, and Jordan is ahead in both metrics both in the regular season and the playoffs.

 

Notice, I circled "playoffs".

Cavs are ranked in red, for comparison purposes.



Hakeem can't touch LeBron's run.

Mo and Jamison have 13 PER, LeBron has 37.

 

Yet, you're trying to use PER now, which means you just invalidated all your complaining.

Where did I say, those are my exact rankings, or that I can't rank them? That doesn't make any sense.

You don't understand tiers apparently, which are still rankings, Now if you want precise rankings that's easy, just look at career WS in regular and post-season, combine both and apply AV. That's almost all of it.

Easy, except you don't even know what PER is.

 

Your blind adherence to statistics are showing. Your bias towards Lebron is also showing how you ignore Shaq.

 

Epic miss.

LeBron was Born December 30, 1984, do the math.

http://www.basketball-reference.com...m=1&p1=jamesle01&y1=2010&p2=jordami01&y2=1988

 

Then why do you keep trying to use PER, only to have me point out your flaws?

 

Re-read the thread. But it's off-topic at this point now that you have given the "magic" formula.

WS is easy enough. How does one apply AV?

Just looking at career WS for Regular season, Karl Malone is way better than Larry Bird and Magic Johnson. So I am anxious to see how AV effects this. Otherwise, these Career PER and WS/min look much better.

Is this because Jordan's is better for his career or better from age 21-25? Or another reason?

 

Dude, build a web-site that with the tools that basketball-reference.com has with your own definition of player's age & I will be glad to do the math. Alternatively, why don't you do the math and post your spreadsheet.

 

So Pippen had his career year when Jordan was retired?

If Jordan's presence made Pippen, he should have not been able to continue on at that pace. By replacing Jordan's win shares with some mediocre guard's winshares, that accounts for the win increases precisely.

 

You can't do elementary math, that just reflects on you dude.

February 17, 1963.

December 30, 1984.

That's the last time I mention this brah, calculate their birthdates and tell me why the heck I would use 26 year old Jordan.

 

Imma beast, AV eliminates garbage seasons like MJ had with the Wizards.

I told you a long time ago that was a basis for me, you just change subjects so much.

 

How is MJ's seasons with the Wizards garbage? By PER, they are 2 of the 10 best seasons of all time for a player 38 or older.

http://www.basketball-reference.com...t&c3val=&c4stat=&c4comp=gt&c4val=&order_by=ws

Actually, you keep changing the subject. What's the magic formula?

Again, once you have carrer WS (regular season+playoffs), how do you apply AV?

 

If it's good enough for basketball-research, it's good enough for me.

Besides even if Lebron were as far ahead of Jordan with your definition of age as Jordan is ahead of Lebron with basketball-research, then we would be down to the subjective portion of the evaluation. Otherwise, David Robinson would be a lock for all-time top 5 player.

 

So Jordan didn't understand the game of basketball until 28 years old, and then he became some magical teacher all of a sudden? And he didn't teach any other player how to be a Hall of Famer...

Seems pretty far fetched, you have to admit. And in addition you want me to give him credit as the under 25 GOAT? Doesn't make sense to me Denny..

 

Lol you're going to defend one of the biggest ball hog seasons ever?

AV is beast, because it doesn't reward padding.

I mentioned it to you already in this thread, the exact formula for it. That's what happens when you skim over so much.

 

Because no one has, 23.9 years old and 23.75 years old in an age column. So stop being vague, like you enjoy being with numbers. This is an under 25 debate. When LeBron turns 26 I'll inform you.

He's still ahead of Jordan regardless, except you're not understanding another stat. They're 10 months apart in age in your scenario, compared to 2 with my calculation.

Incorrect, tell me where I have ignored PLAYOFF winshares and PER? You're the one doing that, not me. David Robinson doesn't have the same playoff winshares and PER as other superstars.My methods are better because instead of "blindly" giving credit for titles, I only give you credit based on how well you played. Which is what matters.