These are two teams who are built on intensity, and that's why this situation erupted in the manor it did. Does anyone believe this situation would have occured had Michael Jordan been on the court? How about Kobe? It's about class, it's about cooler heads prevailing. Artest, Jackson, O'Neal, Wallace, and the rest of these two teams let their emotions get the best of them and that's unfortunate.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting King James X3:</div><div class="quote_post"> Artest, Jackson, O'Neal, Wallace, and the rest of these two teams let their emotions get the best of them and that's unfortunate.</div> yea but very exciting and entertaining. this is show-biz.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Oneinpower:</div><div class="quote_post">so the fan that got punch for nothing at all should just sit there no way if i was at the game a Ron was punching my friend that didn't do anything i would have thrown some punches too. like family look at it both ways too</div> I didnt say the guy shouldnt have thrown back. Throw beer at me, Im coming for you. Simple. But why did the fans continue to throw beer, garbage, and try to take shots at Artest even after he was being escorted out. Why did they keep trying to get closer to them by walking on the court? For what purpose? To fuel the fire.....
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting trenchteam:</div><div class="quote_post">fans are not allowed on the courtside. What the heck was he doing there provoking Oneal and Artest. They deserved it. They were not suppose to be there. they were there for one reason. To harass Artest. Bottom Line.</div> one fan threw a beer so why go after any fan that you think threw it your making it seem like all the fan were on the court. What if your momwife was at the game? where would you want her to do. stay on the court to get away or just sit there and have a 6-8 man just punch her
For those of you who thought Ron Artest deserved that Ben Wallace push in the face: <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Artest scored 24 points and initially showed remarkable restraint. With 45 seconds left, he fouled Ben Wallace, who clearly overreacted and shoved Artest with a chokehold. Artest walked away but was followed by Wallace, who had to be restrained. While players from both teams jawed at each other and order was being restored, Artest lay down on the scorer's table when he was hit with the bottle, and the Palace looked like a prison riot.</div> http://www.nba.com/games/20041119/INDDET/recap.html Even the NBA.com didn't think Artest chickened out. He walked away because he wasn't afraid, but he was trying not to make it bigger until that fan paralized his brain and cut his fuses.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Henacy:</div><div class="quote_post">I truely think Ben Wallace was looking for a fight cause the Pistons were taking an L. For someone who learned to play basketball under Charles Oakley, he has given and been apart of way harder foul situations then that. Ben Wallace got that crowd stir up when he was walking around huffing & puffing about nothing. And then he throw a towel at the man. So fans threw the first thing they had in their hands which was beer. Even when the coaching staff got in between Artest and had him backing off Wallace still wanted to go at it. So I definately think Wallace has alot bigger role in this then some Piston fans want to accept.</div> hmmm...you do have a good point there. ben should have settled down after as well. but that still obviously doesnt excuse artest running into the crowd. a pro athlete should show a little more self control then that
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting trenchteam:</div><div class="quote_post">I didnt say the guy shouldnt have thrown back. Throw beer at me, Im coming for you. Simple. But why did the fans continue to throw beer, garbage, and try to take shots at Artest even after he was being escorted out. Why did they keep trying to get closer to them by walking on the court? For what purpose? To fuel the fire.....</div> like you said "Family" everyone there is going to watch each others backs
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting King James X3:</div><div class="quote_post">These are two teams who are built on intensity, and that's why this situation erupted in the manor it did. Does anyone believe this situation would have occured had Michael Jordan been on the court? How about Kobe? It's about class, it's about cooler heads prevailing. Artest, Jackson, O'Neal, Wallace, and the rest of these two teams let their emotions get the best of them and that's unfortunate.</div> MJ is my favorite dude of all time, but he has been in his fare share of altercations himself. But MJ knows how far to take it, a little pushing and shoving with Danny Ainge, Kevin Johnson, or X-man, is a different breed from what went on tonight. But its kind of hard to compare, even tho MJ just retired times are alot different. Poeple's mentalties are alot different. As much as fans hated MJ in some arenas I dont think that anyone would have ever disrespected him the way they did Artest. I think it has alot to do with the player involved. Its Ron Artest, the media makes him out to be a mad man, so of course fans are going to try & push his buttons. And dont mention Kobe's name during fight talks Laker fans get Chris Childs flaskbacks.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting dj_premium_plus:</div><div class="quote_post">artest represents the team...if he doesnt want to hurt his team, then he should put a moments thought into his actions. dont blame the league for hurting the team by suspending artest, blame artest. he brought it on himself, he brought it on his team</div> Why shouldn't I blame the league? No one's pointing a gun to their head and forcing them to suspend Artest for the season. In 1995 years ago Vernon Maxwell got a 10 game suspension for punching out a fan who was heckling him. Is it fair to make Artest's suspension a full season, after that precedent has been set? One could even argue that he shouldn't be suspended as long, since he was physically provoked THREE times before erupting (Wallace first punched him in the neck, then Wallace threw a towel at him, and THEN a fan threw a drink at him).
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Oneinpower:</div><div class="quote_post">one fan threw a beer so why go after any fan that you think threw it your making it seem like all the fan were on the court. What if your momwife was at the game? where would you want her to do. stay on the court to get away or just sit there and have a 6-8 man just punch her?</div>My mom or wife at the game? A 6-8 man punch her?. Did you see a player hitting a lady? If for some bizzare reason some NBA player would go up in the stands to punch a old lady, I definately would have defended her. What the heck does punching my mother have to do with the events that happened? Where are you getting your logic? And one man throwing a beer? I saw beer bottles and alcohol being thrown everywhere. I saw a chair thrown to JOneal. oh, thats right, Artest did all of that.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Oneinpower:</div><div class="quote_post">like you said "Family" everyone there is going to watch each others backs</div>Yeah, watch each others backs, not fuel a fire after the people involved are already restrained. Artest was restrained and being walked out. Fans keep throwing things at him. What does that have to do with "Watching each others backs?"
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting durvasa:</div><div class="quote_post">Why shouldn't I blame the league? No one's pointing a gun to their head and forcing them to suspend Artest for the season. In 1995 years ago Vernon Maxwell got a 10 game suspension for punching out a fan who was heckling him. Is it fair to make Artest's suspension a full season, after that precedent has been set? One could even argue that he shouldn't be suspended as long, since he was physically provoked THREE times before erupting (Wallace first punched him in the neck, then Wallace threw a towel at him, and THEN a fan threw a drink at him).</div> Yeah I remember that situation with Mad Max. And I remember a situation with the Knicks & Clippers around that same time. And it got really out of hand and no one got suspend for the season. Derek Harper got like 8 games. And I remember the Heat- Knicks fight during the playoffs the NBA spreaded out suspenions not the LJ-Zo fight, the other one where Charlie Ward got WWF'd by PJ Brown. Anyway I think thats the way the NBA should do it, with this fight. Suspend Jackson, Oneal, & Artest for 10 games a piece but spread it out so they all arent suspended at the same time. So the Pacers can stay a competive team. I dont think you just hand the Pistons the East title like that, when there side has alot of wrong in the situation as well.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting durvasa:</div><div class="quote_post">Why shouldn't I blame the league? No one's pointing a gun to their head and forcing them to suspend Artest for the season. </div> oh come on now...you cant be serious. are you saying that because nobody is putting a gun to their head, his actions should go unpunished? obviously not...why even make that comment? artest has a history of unsportsmanlike conduct...if he gets off easy on this one then he'll never change. i cant believe some of you are supporting ron on this one.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting trenchteam:</div><div class="quote_post">My mom or wife at the game? A 6-8 man punch her. Did you see a player hitting a lady? And for some bizzare reason and NBA would go up in the stands to punch a old lady, I definately would have defended her. What the heck does punching my mother have to do with the events that happened? Where are you getting your logic? And one man throwing a beer? I saw beer bottles and alcohol being thrown everywhere. I saw a chair thrown to JOneal. oh, thats right, Artest did all of that.</div> from you this is what you said "Well, there alot of people calling him a maniac, and blaming him for the entire event. And that was has me fueled. But I've been in fights when it involved defending teammates who I consider family. Professionalism is thrown out the door. The fans kept provoking. Relentless all the way into the Locker Room. Even after Artest was restrained, they kept coming at him." I guess you didn't see the little boys crying and the women that were knock to the ground. If you act like a wild animal then don't cry why you are being treated like an animal. you only looking at it if you were the player. why are you suprise that fan defended the fanmates like family too.
Artest and Jackson definately should recieve suspensions and stiff fines. The fans caught on tape should be prosecuted. Ben Wallace deserves just as much as a suspension as well. In the end, it just a terrible situation for the NBA and those who watch the NBA for the love of the game.
What i find kind of funny is some of the news people saying stupid crap like: "this is the worst thing ever in professional sports". They can't be serious... have they never heard of the riots that go on at south american soccer games?? Well so many people should be suspended in this its ridiculous. First of all theres the whole, leave the bench suspensions, added on top of that the fan the ben the blah blahb lah, it jsut goes on. You're just going to have to hope that the league does whatever you agree with, which they probably won't. They'll probably do something weird that will tick a lot of people off, you know how that goes.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting trenchteam:</div><div class="quote_post">Yeah, watch each others backs, not fuel a fire after the people involved are already restrained. Artest was restrained and being walked out. Fans keep throwing things at him. What does that have to do with "Watching each others backs?"</div> but that was way after you acted like a fool what you think when Shaq play Kobe on christmas that he is going to give him a big hug.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Oneinpower:</div><div class="quote_post">from you this is what you said "Well, there alot of people calling him a maniac, and blaming him for the entire event. And that was has me fueled. But I've been in fights when it involved defending teammates who I consider family. Professionalism is thrown out the door. The fans kept provoking. Relentless all the way into the Locker Room. Even after Artest was restrained, they kept coming at him." I guess you didn't see the little boys crying and the women that were knock to the ground. If you act like a wild animal then don't cry why you are being treated like an animal. you only looking at it if you were the player. why are you suprise that fan defended the fanmates like family too.</div> Yeah, the poeple being stepped on an knocked to the ground were mostly by other fans, pushing and shoving to throw things at the Pacers. SO much for family. It could have been an isolated event in one part of the stadium. But no, everyone wanted to get in on it. Theres a big difference bro between Artest and Jackson fighting a couple guys, and a entire crowd rioting. 3/4 of the injuries were due to the rioting fans, not Artest or Jackson. Dont even start talking about women knocked over. Half of them were knocked over by people trying to get involved. It wasn't like the Artest had an army on his side. Its one man and a couple of teammates. yeah, they ran all over the place knockiing everyone over.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting dj_premium_plus:</div><div class="quote_post">oh come on now...you cant be serious. are you saying that because nobody is putting a gun to their head, his actions should go unpunished? obviously not...why even make that comment?</div> Where did I say his actions should go unpunished? Actually, I've said multiple times that he deserves a suspension. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">artest has a history of unsportsmanlike conduct...if he gets off easy on this one then he'll never change.</div> He should be suspended. I think he should be suspended for several games. Suspending him for a season is going overboard. BTW, Maxwell had his problems with the league before his foray into the stands as well, but the NBA didn't deem it necessary to suspend him for a season then. I really don't think that severe a punishment is warranted now, either. Perhaps you didn't see the whole thing live, but you need to understand that Artest was showing amazing restraint before getting pummeled in the head by that drink. I was genuinely surprised that he didn't retaliate against Ben. I think that should count for something, and that's part of the reason I'm vehemently against this idea of suspending him for a whole season.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Oneinpower:</div><div class="quote_post">but that was way after you acted like a fool what you think when Shaq play Kobe on christmas that he is going to give him a big hug.</div> Bro, Im done arguing with you. Im laughing so hard at your statements. Im not sure what Kove and Christmas has to do with the Riot today, but before I get in trouble for making dumb comments, I better just stop.
