Politics Please say rock bottom is getting close

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by calvin natt, Apr 5, 2022.

  1. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I don't think Joe Biden is telling voters they have no morals. I agree about the need to give people hope. But it's always bullshit to say 'elect me and I'll fix everything'.

    barfo
     
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  2. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

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  3. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    Joe is not, you're right. CNN and MSNBC who support Joe, do though. I agree it's bullshit to say that, but you have to give people your vision on how to better the country.
     
  4. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    Agreed, but the party always had everyone else and they'll likely have them again this time. It's those other segments you can't count on. That's why you need to speak to them more to get them to come out. That won't happen the same way this time.

    Sure.


    I didn't know Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema were Republicans?

    People vote on feelings. That's the thing. But the corruption in the country is not feeling, it's facts. When the richest nation in world history just had a 12% spike in homelessness. Don't have affordable healthcare or education. Those aren't feelings. Those are facts.
     
  5. Kano John

    Kano John Start 'em young!

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    The affordable care act has insured over 40 million people so far. The best thing about it is that ACA prohibits Insurance companies from denying insurance due to pre existing conditions. It's amazing to me that many red states still refuse to implement it in their state despite the profound need.
     
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  6. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Then you weren't paying attention.

    Those may be facts, but I'm not so sure it is corruption. Unless, again, you are using a very different definition of corruption.

    barfo
     
  7. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Assuming votes are in the bag is how you lose elections. And what you do to attract one set of voters has the potential to alienate another set of voters.

    barfo
     
  8. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    Totally agreed. It was a huge leap forward. Not what progressives like me wanted, but we can't deny it was a great thing at the time. Unfortunately, it's people in red states with the most medical care debt in the country because of what you just pointed out. I don't think most people know they're voting against their best interests. We don't have a media that informs its public.
     
  9. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    Joe could have put pressure on them, Barfo. To suggest Biden couldn't actually do anything about it is asinine. Again, that notion comes from the mainstream media. There's always a foil in the Democratic party. Why is that? Because their donors are the same as the Republicans.

    I don't know how you couldn't call that corruption. The people at the top fund the politicians and keep them from actually changing anything. You're free to think otherwise though I suppose.
     
  10. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    Who is the genocide on Gaza appealing to? Donors maybe, but not voters. It's not as complicated as you make it. FDR taxed the shit out of the rich and he kept getting re-elected. Take care of the people and they'll vote for you. It's not hard.
     
  11. Kano John

    Kano John Start 'em young!

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    Agreed - Sad to me that Trump ran on a platform of repeal and replace and yet after 4 years in office and 3 years out of office we have yet to see any hint of a feasible alternative from him or any Republican in Congress. What's especially sad (and ironic) is how many people who desperately need affordable health care will still vote for Trump and his minions.
     
  12. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    I agree. It's super sad. Especially the older demographic who gets brainwashed by conservative media. I've seen it close up. You know who used to go on Fox News and win every audience over? Bernie Sanders. Trump wouldn't exist if Bernie was the candidate. Remember, many Obama and Bernie voters went to Trump in '16.
     
  13. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    How? What leverage did he have over them?

    No, that notion comes from the realization that Manchin and Sinema are individuals who simply don't care about the same things Biden does, and don't want or need Biden's approval or support or money or anything else from him.

    I'd say that's not corruption, that's the American system of government and campaign funding. I'd say the rules desperately need reform, but I don't think it's corruption if they are playing by the rules.

    barfo
     
  14. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    Manchin's daughter was under investigation. The administration gave his wife a job. He had absolute leverage. I know it's not something mainstream media shared. I'll let you dig into the rest.

    Lmao the same Biden who threw more black people in prison than anyone and made it so you can't lose your student debt through bankruptcy? He's been a right winger all his career.

    Bribery by definition is corruption. But it's legal. By those standards you can't call Russia or China corrupt. That's out of touch and we will always disagree.
     
  15. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    There are quite a large number of pro-Israel, anti-Palestine voters. Probably many fewer than a few months ago, but still quite substantial.

    It's not as conspiratorial/corrupt as you make it. FDR had huge majorities in congress. Biden doesn't.

    barfo
     
  16. Kano John

    Kano John Start 'em young!

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    One of the issues that Republicans are harping about is the Federal deficit. The deficit was made worse in 2017 with the big Trump/Republican tax breaks. Watch what they say next year when the tax breaks are due to expire.
    When 2025 draws to a close, so will many of the sweeping Trump-era GOP tax breaks established by the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA) of 2017.
     
  17. Phatguysrule

    Phatguysrule Well-Known Member

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    Aren't the tax cuts for businesses permanent while the tax breaks for individuals are expiring?
     
  18. Kano John

    Kano John Start 'em young!

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    Some of the corporate cuts were but not all. No idea how many $$ are involved.
     
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  19. AmirIcon

    AmirIcon Well-Known Member

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    It's not 50/50, dude. Take a look at the polling. And then he said out loud that he's a Zionist. He's going to get his ass handed to him in Michigan and it won't be anyone's fault but his own, no matter what you say differently.


    Oh, you're one of those. Biden can't do anything about anything because of the boogeyman that is Republicans. Like Obama couldn't do anything about abortion, but didn't because he and the party wanted to fundraise off of it. Sure thing. You're giving more reasons as to why the entire system needs to be uprooted and turned upside down.
     
  20. barfo

    barfo triggered obsessive commie pinko boomer maniac Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Right, Joe could have influenced the Justice department in that investigation. That certainly wouldn't have backfired in any way.
    It's an odd suggestion from someone who is concerned about corruption, isn't it?

    As for Manchin's wife, I would assume that she got the job in an attempt to influence Joe M. It obviously didn't work. What more could have been done (legally)?

    He's been a politician his entire career, no doubt.

    That's fine. I don't think we disagree about reality on this, just about what word to use to describe it.

    barfo
     

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