<div class="quote_poster">NTC Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I just dont see why people cant believe in themselves, have faith in themselves, rather than this "thing" that doesnt exist. Believe you can be a good person, have faith that you will lead a good life, dont have faith in somthing else that isnt going to help you in anyway shape or form, that doesnt exist.</div> Well a lot of people believe in God because of their own personal experiences (not necessarily because they read the Bible and felt like believing in God). You may have felt you haven't come across him but that is another issue. I just feel it isn't appropriate to take the Bible literally or ignore evolution and such. The problem with religion is how fanatical some people can be. Chutney and I do not hold the same religious beliefs, but he has a very deep understanding of other religions and why God's motives cannot be encompassed in the human brain. Just something I observed.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Run BJM:</div><div class="quote_post">Why does it even matter if its real or not? It helps some people out a lot. Ignorance is bliss and sometimes I often envy people who have that sort of faith and blind hope even when everything sucks for them.</div> I just don't understand how people sidestep facts in search of a blind faith. You're lying to yourself just to comfort your ego. Life's gonna suck at times, that's what makes it beautiful. The balance of life, the good and evil, the happy and sad is what makes it such an amazing journey. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Chutney:</div><div class="quote_post">Plus, not all prayer is meant to ask for something. Sometimes I pray just to get away from it all and get a peaceful state of mind. That can help me stay level-headed and content in way that reason and logic never could (not saying reason and logic are unnecessary, just saying they don't solve everything).</div> There's also meditation, nature, and of course drugs. All harmonious, divine things that help you reach a state of mind that encourages peace without having to lie to you and boost your ego. Rather, the opposite. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting NTC:</div><div class="quote_post">I just dont see why people cant believe in themselves, have faith in themselves, rather than this "thing" that doesnt exist. Believe you can be a good person, have faith that you will lead a good life, dont have faith in somthing else that isnt going to help you in anyway shape or form, that doesnt exist.</div> Thank you. Be your own person, your own God in a sense. Know that we are all connected and enjoy that. Enjoy the harmony and dissonance and invite it into your life equally. To sidestep the negative things in life because some book says it's bad is to not experience life in it's fullest and most wonderful form. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting VC:</div><div class="quote_post">It's because you're still deriving these concepts of self-actualization from organized religion. What is a "good person," and what is a "good life"? Morality is defined by religion, and without religion, morality becomes subjective.</div> If you let it do that to you, and take things in their widely-accepted form, then it overtakes you and makes you believe those things. Morality is not defined by religion, because religion is made up. If anything religion is defined by morality (which we are born with and come to develop moreso with our intuitiveness and logic and reason). You gotta strip yourself of a belief system and the accepted status quo of what is acceptable and what is not to actually conquer the idea of the existence of morality. Otherwise, you're blinded by such things as religion, governmental influences, etc. Throughout human history, as our species has faced the frightening, terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are, or where we're going in this ocean of chaos, it has been the authorities: the political, the religious, the educational authorities, who have attempted to comfort us by giving us order, rules, regulations. Informing, forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question authority and learn how to put yourself in a state of vulnerable open-mindedness-- chaotic, confused vulnerability to inform yourself. -- Timothy Leary In that sense, you strip yourself to your bare survival instinct and build upon yourself with pure, unfiltered thoughts of what morality truly is. There is no purer way to do that than to observe nature. To think morality is defined by religion is to be ignorant and not take in the whole spectrum of what it could be. Just because religion rules the world, does not make it right or even true... A belief, however necessary it may be for the preservation of a species, has nothing to do with truth. The falseness of a judgment is not for us necessarily an objection to a judgment. The question is to what extent it is life-promoting, life-preserving, species preserving, perhaps even species cultivating. To recognize untruth as a condition of life--that certainly means resisting accustomed value feelings in a dangerous way; and a philosophy that risks this would by that token alone place itself beyond good and evil.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Sasha:</div><div class="quote_post">There's also meditation, nature, and of course drugs. All harmonious, divine things that help you reach a state of mind that encourages peace without having to lie to you and boost your ego. Rather, the opposite.</div> How does the type of prayer I described boost the ego and lie to you? If anything, its almost the same thing as meditation (in a lot of the Indic religions, the two are synonymous). That level-headedness and contentment I try to achieve when I pray is the opposite of being egotistical.
Because you pray to some holy entity, that does not exist. It doesn't so much boost your ego (I was wrong there), as it makes you lie to yourself to feel comfortable and fearless of whatever you're praying for/about. If you want to get rid of some kind of fear or some kind of negative energy, then do so with your own relationship to yourself and the world, not some unexplained phenomena we label as God.
<div class="quote_poster">Sasha Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Morality is not defined by religion, because religion is made up. If anything religion is defined by morality (which we are born with and come to develop moreso with our intuitiveness and logic and reason). You gotta strip yourself of a belief system and the accepted status quo of what is acceptable and what is not to actually conquer the idea of the existence of morality. Otherwise, you're blinded by such things as religion, governmental influences, etc. Throughout human history, as our species has faced the frightening, terrorizing fact that we do not know who we are, or where we're going in this ocean of chaos, it has been the authorities: the political, the religious, the educational authorities, who have attempted to comfort us by giving us order, rules, regulations. Informing, forming in our minds their view of reality. To think for yourself you must question authority and learn how to put yourself in a state of vulnerable open-mindedness-- chaotic, confused vulnerability to inform yourself. -- Timothy Leary In that sense, you strip yourself to your bare survival instinct and build upon yourself with pure, unfiltered thoughts of what morality truly is. There is no purer way to do that than to observe nature. To think morality is defined by religion is to be ignorant and not take in the whole spectrum of what it could be. Just because religion rules the world, does not make it right or even true... A belief, however necessary it may be for the preservation of a species, has nothing to do with truth. The falseness of a judgment is not for us necessarily an objection to a judgment. The question is to what extent it is life-promoting, life-preserving, species preserving, perhaps even species cultivating. To recognize untruth as a condition of life--that certainly means resisting accustomed value feelings in a dangerous way; and a philosophy that risks this would by that token alone place itself beyond good and evil.</div> Swiss psychologist Jean Piaget probably went the most in-depth of any researcher in determining the root of morality. As Piaget observed, a child is born heteronomous, meaning that its morality is based on "do's" and "don'ts." At this stage, a child is completely devoid of independant thinking and only bases their actions on potential consequences. This stems from the child's cognitive structure being rooted in egocentrism. They value the rules, but they don't value the purpose of the rules (hence young kids caring more about being caught doing something 'wrong' than the 'wrong' act itself). As a child grows and learns, they adapt to their surroundings and what are societal norms. It is not until the child reaches the formal operational stage of cognitive development (usually around age 11 until adulthood) that they are able to think abstractly, and by that time, morality has already been formed. So the question then becomes, where do the societal norms stem from? I think it's innate in the sense that it's evolutionary and was passed down to us by our ancestors to maintain order as a species, more often than not, in the form of religion. We were all born without a set of morals though, meaning morality, without God, is subjective.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Sasha:</div><div class="quote_post">Because you pray to some holy entity, that does not exist. It doesn't so much boost your ego (I was wrong there), as it makes you lie to yourself to feel comfortable and fearless of whatever you're praying for/about. If you want to get rid of some kind of fear or some kind of negative energy, then do so with your own relationship to yourself and the world, not some unexplained phenomena we label as God.</div> No, I don't really agree with that either. I'm not lying to myself about reality, so much as I'm trying to find a sense of calmness so I can go deal with everyday life in a more clear-headed state. I mean, you might even say that my prayers help me become more logical/reasonable, instead of getting caught up in desires/emotions. And if it takes a belief in some sort of unknowable power (be it God, karma, nature, etc.) to achieve that state of mind, then so be it.
Are you not relying on some being "hearing" your words in an order to find that peace though? If not, then I could pray to the Wendy's cup sitting next to me and treat it the same way. People pray, because they want to be heard. Prayer is selfish. In that sense, it's very egocentric. If you don't want to be heard but still find peace, then why pray when you can just take a stroll in a forest, or meditate. Do you understand what I'm getting at. People that pray, want to find a connection with something/someone else to help them out with their thoughts and feelings. That's the main problem I find with a lot of people, their not independent with their thoughts and feelings. They rely on outside influences too much. Thus, the fear aspect. VC, I'll get back to yours later on. I gotta get ready for work. Though, Erik Erikson > Jean Piaget.
Umm I'm not all that religious, i believe in Jesus the holy spirit etc, but i have a real strong faith in God, and Jesus. The reason is because how my life has been. My parent's gave up their whole lives to come to America, and times where tough for them (i was only 2-7). The only thing holding my mom together is her belief that God would make everything better. i went from living in a project building to my parents making over 6 figures in less than 10 years. Also i only had one person close to me die, and several real close to death. And i feel that God is why all this happened. I believe God helped my parents through the tough times and my family members who were close to death. I've also had plenty of times where i felt as if i wanted to just crack and give up on something but i felt this power in me to continue wheather its studying for a test, or something more difficult. And when i do something i know i shouldnt i feel a sense of guilt that i did something wrong in God's eyes. I feel as if God has looked over me and helped me and my loved ones and i betrayed him in some waywhen i do something wrong. And i quote this from a song, When times get tough everyone speaks to God, weather you believe in him or not. I feel everyone will have a chance to accept God weather they are born athiest or grow to be athest something in your life will come up where you need that strength and then you have the chance in believing in God
Homer: Left Below! were have I heard that before? Lisa: It's the title of the movie Homer: It's everywhere! Lol, good post Chutney. Way to show everyone that when you watch the Simpsons, religon is funny.
<div class="quote_poster">Master Shake Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Homer: Left Below! were have I heard that before? Lisa: It's the title of the movie Homer: It's everywhere!</div> See this is what I'm talking about in regards to dumb humour, how on earth that is funny is beyond me. As I read somewhere, Homer Simpson has just become a parody of himself.
I work in the photo center at Walgreens, and today four different old ladies had me scan/edit/print pictures for them. The kiosk is supposed to be for self-use. And the entire time, all I hear is stories about their grandkids. Sigh. It's a pretty cool job though, I work with a hot girl who I learned is also a big fan of Brand New. I think I shall invite her to the upcoming concert with me once I talk to her more. Poop.
The Simpsons up to about Season 6 or 7 were by far the funniest cartoon on T.V. I found as the Simpsons started going downhill, cartoons like Futurama and Family Guy were there to be as funny as the Simpsons used to be. However, even Family Guy started resorting to stupid humour after a while, and I never really caught on to Futurama. The Simpsons is pretty stupid nowadays. I just watched an episode with the planes in Springfield changing thier flight routes and flying over the Simpsons house. After about 15 minutes, I switched and watched something else cause some of the jokes were so stupid it was annoying me. Especially Homer's stupidity. My favourite episode would probably have to be the one about the lemon tree from Shelbyville though. Everything about the episode was perfect. I also liked Homer vs. NYC where the Simpsons go to New York. Unfortunetly, they don't really show that episode anymore since a good portion of the episode centers around the twin towers (episode was made 1997 or so I believe). Luckily though, I have the episode on tape somewhere and whenever I go back and check out my old recordings and that episode comes up, it's always a fun watch. I remember growing up I used to love Seinfeld, Fresh Prince and the Simpsons. I don't really watch that much T.V nowadays but it seems like there is nothing but reality shows, game shows, serious dramas or stupid comedy whenever I turn it on.
<div class="quote_poster">NTC Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">See this is what I'm talking about in regards to dumb humour, how on earth that is funny is beyond me. As I read somewhere, Homer Simpson has just become a parody of himself.</div> Hater. Simple comedy is much more than the dumb jokes. It's the delivery and the expressions that make the joke. Look at Dane Cook, he's a terrible comedian. Don't buy his cd's, they suck. But I'll watch some live performances because his delivery and facial expressions make the joke.
<div class="quote_poster">Mamba Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Hater. Simple comedy is much more than the dumb jokes. It's the delivery and the expressions that make the joke. Look at Dane Cook, he's a terrible comedian. Don't buy his cd's, they suck. But I'll watch some live performances because his delivery and facial expressions make the joke.</div> It doesnt work in a cartoon though. The best Simpsons episode was the Duff Gardens one. Invalid Video Link
<div class="quote_poster">Karma Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">The Simpsons up to about Season 6 or 7 were by far the funniest cartoon on T.V. I found as the Simpsons started going downhill, cartoons like Futurama and Family Guy were there to be as funny as the Simpsons used to be. However, even Family Guy started resorting to stupid humour after a while, and I never really caught on to Futurama.</div> I agree for the most part, especially about Family Guy, but with the Simpsons for me personally it started to go downhill a little after season four. Family Guy was amazing the first three seasons, now it doesn't even make sense at all. Where as before there were plots, now there are so many cut off plots that nothing seems to tie together in the end. Futurama is tied with the Angry Beavers for my favorite cartoons of all-time. I love much older stuff too, but those two I can watch any time any day and always enjoy it. For television sitcoms I absolutely love Frasier. At first I thought it was annoying as hell with those two rich psych jackass brothers, but after a while it caught on and for years now I still can't get enough of this show. I own every season on DVD. I loved the plots to just about every episode because they were often refreshing and new. Yet, still holding that charm that Cheers had only funnier and more intelligent. In fact, I'm going to watch a Frasier episode right now.
<div class="quote_poster">M Two One Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I agree for the most part, especially about Family Guy, but with the Simpsons for me personally it started to go downhill a little after season four. Family Guy was amazing the first three seasons, now it doesn't even make sense at all. Where as before there were plots, now there are so many cut off plots that nothing seems to tie together in the end. Futurama is tied with the Angry Beavers for my favorite cartoons of all-time. I love much older stuff too, but those two I can watch any time any day and always enjoy it. </div> Angry Beavers was one of my favourite shows of all-time as well. As a kid, when it came to kiddy cartoons, Pinky & the Brain, Doug and Angry Beavers were my favourites. I remember I made a thread a while back about my favourite shows as a kid, it was a good trip down memory lane. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> For television sitcoms I absolutely love Frasier. At first I thought it was annoying as hell with those two rich psych jackass brothers, but after a while it caught on and for years now I still can't get enough of this show. I own every season on DVD. I loved the plots to just about every episode because they were often refreshing and new. Yet, still holding that charm that Cheers had only funnier and more intelligent. </div> For some reason, I could never hold myself to watch Fraiser. Something about the show has always annoyed me. In fact, I was like that with King of the Hill as well, but one time I actually sat and watched an entire episode and it was actually pretty funny. The humour is quite bland and definetly not as funny as the Simpsons or Family Guy, but I can understand why a lot of other people like it. As far as sitcoms go, I was a huge fan of Seinfeld, even though I hated it's last 2 or so seasons. I never really caught on to Friends (although I watch it once in a while nowadays), and other than Seinfeld, Fresh Prince was the only other sitcom that actually made me want to watch it.
King of the Hill is underrated too. My favourite Simpsons is probably the one where Homer gives up church. I tend to change it around, based on which one I've seen lately, but that one's always awesome. For people in the US, have you guys always gotten a channel called AMC? I think my cable company just started picking it up this year and I love it. So many great movies.
