No deflection of 70+ million dead caused by atheists. Their people viewed the cleansing as a moral event.
Hitler and Stalin ... they both based their belief on 'science' and genetics. I have no horse in this race, because I think both sides are ridiculous in their smearing of the other, but you made this too easy.
Atheism is literally a belief that there is no God. I find atheists as faith-based as I find Christians, Muslims, or any other religious group. The 'scientific' approach is to be agnostic, which is what I am.
They are not mutually exclusive. Is not believing in unicorns faith-based? If so, then then fine atheism is too. If its not, if its just saying its silly to believe in something with zero evidence, that's how I see it. You would be looked atas a wacko if you really believed in the Easter bunny or leprechauns. But, technically they could exist, there is no proof otherwise. Hence agnostic and atheistic.
Do you repeat this line because you don't understand, or because you are trying to be confrontational?
No I used "faith" before to be confrontational. The line "belief" is still true. The reason why most atheists dislike that is because "believing" is to assume you don't have the necessary facts to make it a fact. And the fact is atheism must use an agnostic approach towards "lack of belief", whatever they call it. But in most cases... Deep down... One that lacks belief like the unicorns still requires one to not believe because they just haven't seen one yet.
But you see this is the problem, we get sidetracked on definitions and minutia instead of discussing ideas that both you and I have genuine interests in, like our discussion about the earliest moments of the Big Bang and what happens to the four forces at the earliest moments. After that discussion I spent a couple hours surfing the web trying to glean what theories a majority of theoretical physicists were inclined to believe in. If you tell me that when you use a specific phrase, you mean a specific definition, I will then use your definition. When I see a school bus, I see that color as orange. If you tell me that you consider that color yellow, then if you describe something else as school bus yellow I will understand exactly the color you are referring too. I will not start a debate with you every time that I think that color is orange.
Oh I totally respect you and your debating skills. This concept or dig was more to do with the ones that aren't grasping the concept. The ones actually getting angry over some of the stupidest shit. I can understand frustration on both ends. I just love debating. As for the weirdo that jumps in with baffling grammar; it is just a reminder that some people like to read what they write.
Ugh, nope. Not too easy. That they both based their belief on 'science' and genetics (if true) does not clarify which of those beliefs bear upon specific actions. This means you've not established that anyone was killed in the name of atheism or because of an atheistic disposition. That's just you perpetuating a myth. Hitler claimed to be Catholic, gave speaches in public to that effect, etc., so by your logic he must have acted in the name of Christianity, right? Stalin may have been an atheist, but his actions were not done in the name of atheism. You would need to show how his atheist beliefs were the driver of his actions (moreover, which specific beliefs led to which specific actions). You did read my post, right? Perhaps it really was too easy. "Atheism is literally a belief that there is no God." You would be more informed by reading the philosophical literature on the subject. If you did so, you would discover that Atheism is a lack of belief in gods. No doubt there exist people who share this belief with you -- but no doubt many are confused. The only atheist belief is the belief that 'belief in gods is not compelling.' In other words, the atheist position is just the one that says, there's no compelling reason to have beliefs in things like gods ... so they don't Is this too subtle a point? So then, to then make the additional claim that there is no god does not follow from atheism. It's logic, man. "I find atheists as faith-based as I find Christians, Muslims, or any other religious group." Well, where do you find them? Because, with all due respect, the real ones I actually know say you don't know what you are talking about.
When baldness qualifies as having a full head of hair; when not collecting stamps becomes a hobby; sure, then absence of belief will constitute presence of belief.
I know it doesnt apply but for some reason reading the argument of "You are stupid for believing" "no you are stupid for not believing" made me think of the very last square in this Calvin and Hobbes strip
The Hilter point is valid. He piggy backed religion to gain respect of people; but Papa was right as well, because after power, Hitler used an atheistic and scientific approach to brainwash the people in believing that ethic cleaning was just a part of natural process. http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080904101035AAGTMP2 As for Stalin: Then when you asked which "Moral Atheists do can I give that used science and atheism"; you look no further in Stalin. This man tried making super soldiers by using primate DNA and human DNA. It failed and the scientists involve all got executed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marxism_and_religion Here are some Lenin quotes regarding religion: Vladimir Lenin was highly critical of religion, saying in his book Religion "Atheism is a natural and inseparable part of Marxism, of the theory and practice of scientific socialism.[4]" In About the attitude of the working party toward the religion, he wrote "Religion is the opium of the people: this saying of Marx is the cornerstone of the entire ideology of Marxism about religion. All modern religions and churches, all and of every kind of religious organizations are always considered by Marxism as the organs of bourgeois reaction, used for the protection of the exploitation and the stupefaction of the working class.[5]"
BTW... Sorry GOD that this thread was hijacked. I actually liked the muslim discussion better. Maybe "chevyrunssometimes" could start a new thread and use his strawmen there.
