I agree with James being happy as a more athletic Magic, but I think he's such a matchup nightmare for the whole league that there's no way he will (or should) score less than Bosh. I see it shaking out more like this: James: 25/8/8 Wade: 25/5/5 Bosh: 20/10
No Doubt, it could be the same story all over again for LBJ. Roll through the regular season and get stopped short in the playoffs due to lack of depth/or chemistry of the team.
Their depth isn't bad. Really the biggest hole is point guard, but if LBJ plays point forward, they will probably be okay. I could see a lineup of Wade, LeBron, Miller, Bosh, Haslem. Tell me that isn't a scary team.
Actually when Clyde first arrived in Houston it did disrupt the team, at first. A lot of Rockets players publicly said they did not like the trade. Houston finished #6 seed. But they sure pulled it together in the playoffs. IMO, like everyone else nothing but my opinion to go on, I think it will work, this year. They will all be on good behavior, they will get every possible and impossible call. But I really don't see Miami winning a string of 5 or 6 titles. IMHO, the egos will break out after the first championship.
The crazy thing is, even if they don't gel and win it all next year, they aren't going anywhere! They are only gonna get better playing together. That's scary!
What everyone seems to forget about in the "chemistry" debate is that these guys chose to play together. And in their primes, no less. I doubt that has ever happened before (I certainly can't think of any examples), so throw all historical counter-examples out the window. There is nothing to compare this Miami team to that is of any relevance.
Admittedly, this might have some holes because I haven't really thought it all the way through, but I also question this theory of having THREE REALLY GREAT players. Why does it matter if you have three of the best players in the league instead of one? I think we all universally agree that having two future hall-of-famers (like Magic/Kareem, MJ/Pippen, Shaq/Kobe, etc.) provides more than the teams that simply have one of these guys. So you can't argue the fact that two is better than one. But how much value is there if you have three LeBron or even five LeBrons on a team for that matter? What I'm getting at is the fact that you only have one ball and one guy actually creating a scoring opportunity. I think it's safe to say that Rudy without the ball is just about as effective as LeBron without the ball. Rudy runs around and creates defenders to move off their man and creates many alley-oop opportunities from losing his defender, etc. So movement without the ball isn't a "top 5" skill, it's something a lot of guys do. How much difference will it matter to have LeBron and Bosh on the floor when Wade is simply walking the ball up the court? How much value is added for Wade and LeBron watching from the wings when the Chalmers is simply passing the ball into Bosh at the post and he's backing a guy down? At the end of the day, each possession is just one of these players getting the ball and creating their shot, much like Roy, or Kobe, or CP3 or some other player would be doing for their team. The other 4 guys are basically bystanders just watching - whether their names are Adam Morrison or LeBron James. Then that is only half of the time on the clock. Let's not foget the other side of the ball in defense. You have to ask yourself how these great scorers who are known for having passable defense really make much of a difference over teams that have defensive specialist. Miami even with their three greats is still going to give up at least their 90 ppg. None of these guys are top 10 in the league because they're defensive stoppers. It's for their offensive prowess. So it begs the question how much will it really impact this team. Oh, they'll be 60-win good as we've all mentioned, but I'm not convinced yet that even having five Kobes or Lebrons make much of a difference than having two really good all-stars to take the pressure off each other, as this league has has seen a number of times.
I think having 3 superstars creates problems by having to double team them. Each one of the big 3 will demand a double and I believe this will help the NON stars on the squad like Mike Miller. Do you know how many open 3's he's gonna get?!?! Miami did an amazing job filling out that roster! After THE DECISION, I thought there was no way they could land quality role players, but they proved me wrong.
I agree on the role players. I didn't think they'd even have enough money to fill the roster, but they managed. But you're right that it will allow guys to be more open than they would have been given another situation. You can still only score so many ways. I don't think anyone in today's modern era can be efficient enough to score 120ppg, even if you have 5 LeBron on your team creating mismatches and shooting at some type of .600 rate. So that's where I'm going with that. For the limited number of possession you have in a game, they will only have one ball to put into one of their hands at any given moment and can only score so often (just like no batter hits .500). As to double-teams, you can still only double-team the one star with the ball. I don't think you'll ever see a double-team off the ball. So Wade getting the ball at the top of the key might draw a double-team, but how is that different than Kobe getting the ball at the top of the key? How is that not making Pau get an easier opportunity just like it will Bosh or one of Miami's role players. How is Bosh getting the ball in the post and drawing a double-team and kicking it out to Wade any different than KG drawing one and dumping it out to Pierce or Ray Allen? I'd bet on a Ray Allen taking an open three before I'd bet on Wade out there taking an open shot.
True, but I'd also bet on Wade getting the ball on the open side of the court and attacking the rim over Allen shooting a contested shot. At least in terms of efficiency, since Rondo is never doubled at the top of the key, and neither is Pierce.
I do believe Nate's style of offense will be the most effective against Miami. Limit their possessions and you might have a chance!
I don't think this Miami thing will work. There's only one basketball and everybody needs to put their ego's aside. I just don't think outside the top 3 they're a very well tounded team either. Mike Millers alright, everybody else is meh though.
But Zags, what do you need besides those guys? Guys to set picks and rebound! They got that. They also have Miller/Jones/House to camp in the corners and bomb away!
One of those guys could get injured then bam, your basically banking on a 2 horse team. Say Bosh gets hurt, who are they relying on down low? Joel Anthony? Juwan Howard? Big Z, but he's a perimeter player. Lebron and Wade are most effective with the ball in their hands and creating things. I don't think either will flourish playing off the ball. If I were Miami I would have rather signed Bosh, then use the money they used on Lebron to get 2-3 really solid but not spectacular players. I just don't think its going to work.
There is some redundancy and each added superstar has decreased marginal value due to the limited number of shots. You can fully leverage one superstar, fairly close to fully leverage a second superstar and you probably won't come very close to fully leveraging a third superstar. I'd guess that a fourth and fifth superstar would really not bring anything near superstar or even star value. Thus, I don't think they'll be a legendarily unstoppable force. I do think they'll be the best team in basketball, because they'll have the two superstar set-up and Bosh, even if not maximized, will still add more firepower, making them that much harder to defend. They aren't perfectly complimentary...there's no force inside and there isn't a ton of defensive presence. But good coaching should still yield a title favourite. They just have weaknesses that can be attacked and will let them down from time to time. So I think they'll be between 60-70 wins and it'll take a pretty amazing series from another great team to knock them out in the playoffs.
Was it? if so, we agree. I didn't read every post in the thread, I was largely responding to the idea that they aren't clear favourites because they will approximate the chemistry and redundancy of failed Olympic teams. I don't think that's going to be the case. But they certainly are unlikely to be three times as good as your typical one-star team.
I hope the Heat fail but unlike the 2008-10 Celtics who also have three superstars and won a championship, the Heat have LOTS of time. They can afford to fail this season. They're young. And, depending upon the new CBA, they will be able to add a good quality basketball player each year with the MLE. I hope they fail, though.
