Trent.

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by Scalma, Nov 21, 2019.

  1. Wizard Mentor

    Wizard Mentor Wizard Mentor

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    Interesting. I think a turn-back-the-clock healthy Wes would be our starting SF.
     
  2. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    I disagree with that. Blazers are already at a length disadvantage in the back court with Dame and CJ. Portland doesn't need to add to it with the same disadvantage at SF. The starting SF will have to guard players like Durant, Lebron, Kawhi, PG13, Siakam...and they will have to shoot over that kind of length on the other end of the floor. Trent, like Matthews, will be best at SG. I want Portland to have a SF with the length and strength of an Ariza or a Gabriel. Like a Harkless with a lot better offense. Hood is about as small as it should go in the starting unit, but I think Hood's Achilles will limit his impact, unfortunately

    ideally, CJ would be traded for an upgrade at one of the forward positions and some significant cap-relief...and maybe a pick. And Trent moves into the starting line-up, kind of replicating a Matthews or a poor man's Klay Thompson. But the Trent part of that equation is still premature hope at this point
     
  3. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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  4. Wizard Mentor

    Wizard Mentor Wizard Mentor

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    Those players all spend a healthy number of minutes at the 4, and sometimes even the 5. My point is that "going small" is becoming more popular, even with starters.

    Agreed that Hood's Achilles is his Achilles :)
     
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  5. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    Why my stance has been that he’s more than just a spot shooter. He consistently gets to his spots and does it at his own pace. It’s not flashy but it’s effective. Dare I say it reminds me of a certain someone that used to play here...
     
  6. illmatic99

    illmatic99 formerly yuyuza1

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    Look at that first play and see how much of a difference it makes when Hassan makes solid contact on the screen and rolls quickly off of it to seal his man. Opens up a wide open lane for Gary.
     
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  7. Pinwheel1

    Pinwheel1 Well-Known Member

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    There is no doubt in my mind that he has a better all-around offensive game than Wes. His mid-range game is better, he finishes better, and he handles the ball better.

    No doubt Wes had a quick and accurate 3pt shot, but not much else. I thought his post-up game was overrated.
     
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  8. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    It’s like this for me: there’s nothing Wes does/did offensively that Trent couldn’t also do right now. The defense is already good too and will just get better as he learns everyone’s tendencies a little better.
     
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  9. illmatic99

    illmatic99 formerly yuyuza1

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    Wes' impact was a bit more intangible. His tenacity on defense was infectious. Trent might get there, but he needs to play 30+ pg to do so. Does that happen here with a fully healthy backcourt?
     
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  10. TBpup

    TBpup Writing Team

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    Probably not....which is why I'm perfectly fine with him at the '2' as a starter and get from CJ help at the wing.
     
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  11. B-Roy

    B-Roy If it takes months

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    People are forgetting about how good Wes was.
     
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  12. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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    Do you not think that @THE HCP could cut together a highlight vid of Trent from this season that's comparable to those highlights from a 28-year-old Matthews?
     
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  13. B-Roy

    B-Roy If it takes months

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    I don't. A lot of people here are insinuating that Trent is as good now as Matthews in his prime. That's just false.
     
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  14. illmatic99

    illmatic99 formerly yuyuza1

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    I need to see more before definitively claiming he can take over that starting 2 guard role.
     
  15. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    Trent since being a fixture in the rotation (End of December)
    11 PPG (8.7 FGA)
    45.5% FG
    41% 3PT
    1 SPG
    0.3 BPG
    0.4 TOV

    Trent since February 1
    13 PPG (10 FGA)
    47% FG
    43% 3PT
    1.4 SPG
    0.4 BPG
    0.5 TOV

    Matthews’ best season (‘13-14, 27 years old)
    16.4 PPG (12.3 FGA)
    44% FG
    39% 3PT
    1 SPG
    0.2 BPG
    1.3 TOV
     
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  16. Propagandist

    Propagandist Well-Known Member

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    I miss that motherfucker.
     
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  17. HailBlazers

    HailBlazers RipCity

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    Damn.
     
  18. tester551

    tester551 Well-Known Member

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    Some Advanced Stats:

    WES ('13-'14)
    - PER 15.7
    - TS% 0.588
    - 3PAr 0.506
    - FTr 0.298
    - TRB% 5.6
    - AST% 10.9
    - USG% 19.6
    - WS/48 0.142
    - BPM 1.9
    - VORP 2.7
    - Net RTG/100 +8.0

    Trent ('19-'20 - season to date)
    - PER 12.5
    - TS% 0.572
    - 3PAr 0.580
    - FTr 0.100
    - TRB% 4.3
    - AST% 6.3
    - USG% 15.3
    - WS/48 0.083
    - BPM -0.5
    - VORP 0.4
    - Net RTG/100 +2.0

    Not to anyone's surprise, the only advantage that Trent has is he shoots the 3 more frequent than Wes did.

    Trent is still 2 years younger than Wes was as a rookie - so it's obviously not a fair comparison.... but Trent still has a LOT of ground to make up to even match Wes in either of his first 2 years. Wes' biggest advantage was the intensity that he played with. Trent has shown flashes, but I'd like to see more!
     
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  19. JoshuaHall

    JoshuaHall Well-Known Member

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    If it were possible to adjust those numbers for solely post-December, it would be more interesting I think.
     
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  20. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    I intentionally ignored some of the advanced metrics, specifically BPM because I don’t trust DPM to accurately gauge a players defensive impact, especially when it’s the only metric that suggests a player isn’t good on that end. I use it more to confirm other numbers. For example, DPM rated Matthews as a negative defender in two of his seasons in Portland. Of course that’s bullshit, so it’s safe to ignore it. DRPM also had Matthews as a negative defender in his best season above. So when it comes to advanced defensive metrics, I don’t trust them.

    So beyond that, I don’t really see where Wes had clear advantages. The numbers are relatively close (especially when you factor in the difference in usage) and again, we’re comparing a guys prime to a guy that just turned 21.
     

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