I guess anyone who gave Forrest the first round is a big fan of the Olympic method of scoring. The Power of the shot doesn't matter, so long as you land it. I think Jackson won round 1,4, and round 3 and 5 could have gone either way. Whomever gave Griffin 4 rounds is helping Joe Rogan with the pre-fight blunt. I'm Happy Cote won, but ugh it was not a convincing win.. you do get those fights though when you face a superior grappler, you can't try and strike too much because you don't want to be taken down. Still Cote's take down defence was superb. I've never been a big fan or believer in Joe Stevenson and he was getting beat last night until he got the sub.. I'm still not a huge fan of his but the SOB is tough. Lytle is a solid fighter but he'll never be able to hang with the top of the division, this fight just further proved it. I'd not be surprised to see him let go. Griffin is a very good fighter but like Tim Sylvia he doesn't try to finish fights, but just win them by playing it safe. He'll frustrate a lot of fighters but get if he's in line for a title shot, he'll get steamrolled by BJ.
I think that the Hamilton Judge, I believe that was the one, had it right. I had Jackson dominating round's 1 and 4, and I thought Griffin dominated round 2 and won rounds 3 and 5. I thought he did a better job of taking center of the octagon and initiating octagon control for those rounds, and I thought the leg kicks he was landing was the big difference for why he won the rounds he did. I also think that leg kick took alot of power out of Jackson's fists, so when he did land them they didn't hurt as much as if his legs were under him. I thought Cote got lucky, Almeida should have won that fight in my opinion. I was surprised that the judges gave him the win, I didn't see it all that he won. I guess that is part of not locking the fight away early, is that you never know what the judges will do. I like both Griffin and Joe Stevenson, both are solid wrestlers, both are very strong. I think Griffin's biggest problem is that he hasn't been given anyone to face, to prove how good he is. He beat up Gleison for three round's, but past that he hasn't gotten a good fight. I want to see him against one of the gate keepers of the lightweight division, Florian/Stevenson. A win agains one of those two is assured that your in the upper echelon of the UFC lightweights. Lytle is just fun to watch get beat up, I'm surprised he stayed in there. Dude was loosing a load of blood, I thought the ref's might step in and stop the fight because I thought the cut was right above the eye, but I guess it wasn't in a terrible spot. Either way, Koscheck dominated him with some brutal elbows for three rounds.
IMO Cote at least did something in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, Almedia kinda gave up once Cote stuffed his takedown attempts. FYI, you can watch the Gurgel vs Cole Miller 'sub of the night' fight free on UFC.com you can see Forrest's and Rampage's post fight comments at yahoo.com http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/video;_ylt=ArH...WGcYdbFBDI9Eo14
Only thing I have to say about UFC 86 is....how the hell did BJ get such a hot ass girlfriend? seriously its ridiculous. I guess the Rampage fight was alright too......I am still pretty disappointed Rampage lost, nothing againist the scoring, I just think Rampage is better than what he showed last night.
I think the Rampage vs Forrest fights is one of the best fights of the year, even with all the ho-hum decisions this fight made the entire night worth it IMO. Cote winning was sweet for me, how he won was not. The Koscheck bloodfest was kinda kool too.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chocolove @ Jul 7 2008, 01:20 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Only thing I have to say about UFC 86 is....how the hell did BJ get such a hot ass girlfriend? seriously its ridiculous. I guess the Rampage fight was alright too......I am still pretty disappointed Rampage lost, nothing againist the scoring, I just think Rampage is better than what he showed last night.</div> BJ is the man. What did you expect? He's the hero of Hawaii. He's got his run of the place.
Well I personally thought Rampage won the fight, but thought it was possible for Griffin to win it. Part of that is because I give the champ the benefit of the doubt. However I thought it would be a split decision or closer than it was. I think if both players are viewed without the champ status, damn it`s hard. It`s very tight, but I dunno, I`d probably give a slight edge to Forrest. I would have given Rampage round 1, which strangely 2 of the judges gave to Griffin. I definitely think there was damage to Quintin`s knee during the fight, in the 5th round it really showed, he was awkwardly walking, and I think was more hesitant on it.
Yeah 2 judges giving Griffin the 1st round is the biggest head scratcher of them all. I personally would have scored the fight 48-47 for Griffin or Rampage, cause rounds 3 and 4 were total toss ups IMO. Some ppl mentioned the triangle Forrest locked on, but Rampage got out of it quickly and turned it against Forrest with his slam, so I don't think it's that big of a factor to win a round.
Here's the fighters payouts, not including announced and unannounced bonus's Interesting to see Gonzaga got 100K and yet his fight was not aired.. Forrest Griffin: $250,000 (includes $150,000 win bonus) def. Quinton Jackson: $225,000 Patrick Cote: $32,000 ($16,000 win bonus) def. Ricardo Almeida: $23,000 Joe Stevenson: $60,000 ($30,000 win bonus) def. Gleison Tibau: $11,000 Josh Koscheck: $70,000 ($35,000 win bonus) def. Chris Lytle: $14,000 Tyson Griffin: $40,000 ($20,000 win bonus) def. Marcus Aurelio: $40,000 Gabriel Gonzaga: $100,000 ($50,000 win bonus) def. Justin McCully: $5,000 Cole Miller: $20,000 ($10,000 win bonus) def. Jorge Gurgel: $ 10,000 Melvin Guillard: $20,000 ($10,000 win bonus) def. Dennis Siver: $7,000 Justin Buchholz: $8,000 ($4000 win bonus) def. Corey Hill: $8,000
Medical suspenions etc... <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>UFC 86 medical suspensions: Quinton Jackson's leg under review More than half of the UFC 86 roster has been suspended with injuries ranging from head and facial lacerations to shoulder and leg injuries. MMAjunkie.com today obtained the list of official suspensions from the Nevada State Athletic Commission, which oversaw the July 5 event at the Mandalay Bay Events Center in Las Vegas. Quinton Jackson, who lost his title and suffered a unanimous-decision defeat to Forrest Griffin in the night's main event, is suspended until Jan. 2 for possible leg injuries, though he can be cleared early by a doctor. Jackson was hobbled in the second round by back-to-back leg kicks from Griffin, though he had shaken off most of the effects from the blows by the third round. Jackson doesn't expect the leg to keep him sidelined, MMAjunkie.com is told. The full list of suspensions includes: Quinton Jackson - suspended until Jan. 2 due to possible left knee, tibia, fibia and thumb injuries (can be cleared early by orthopedic doctor); minimum suspension until Aug. 5 with no contact until July 27 for precautionary reasons Forrest Griffin - suspended until Sept. 4 due to right-upper-eyelid laceration (can be cleared early by doctor) Chris Lytle - suspended until Sept. 4 due to laceration near right eye (can be cleared early by doctor) Josh Koscheck - suspended until Aug. 5 with no contact July 27 for precautionary reasons Marcus Aurelio - suspended until Jan. 2 due to possible left-thumb ligament injury (can be cleared early by orthopedic doctor); minimum suspension until Aug. 5 with no contact until July 27 for precautionary reasons Justin McCully - suspended until Jan. 2 due to possible left-shoulder injury (can be cleared early by doctor) Cole Miller - suspended until Sept. 4 due to facial lacerations (can be cleared early by doctor) Jorge Gurgel - suspended until Jan. 2 due to right tibia, fibia and elbow injuries (can be cleared early by orthopedic doctor) Dennis Siver - suspended until Aug. 20 with no contact until Aug. 5 for precautionary reasons Justin Buchholz - suspended until Sept. 4 due to scalp laceration (can be cleared early by doctor)</div>
That news was a couple of day's old, here's an update on Rampage. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Deep bone bruise for Quinton Jackson, due back in gym next week With no serious damage done to his left leg, former UFC light heavyweight champion Quinton Jackson is expected back in the gym Monday. Jackson, who lost a hard-fought and -- in the eyes of many -- controversial five-round decision to Forrest Griffin at UFC 86 Saturday, had his leg examined today and was cleared to resume training next week. He will have to avoid any immediate direct contact to the still-tender lower part of the leg. "After the fight, he had a knot the size of a cantaloupe on his shin," Jackson's trainer, Juanito Ibarra, told MMAjunkie.com (www.mmajunkie.com). "I've never seen anything like it in all the years I've been in the fight game. It was ugly. The next day it went down. Today, there's no bump at all. The doctor said he's fine. It's a deep bone bruise now. He's totally fine. There's no damage. All we're waiting for now is the rematch." Jackson's shin, not the knee, absorbed most of the punishment from Griffin's kicks, according to Ibarra, who believes the rematch should happen right away. "Why shouldn't it?" he asked. "Forrest said after the fight he didn't want to do it again, but he had to, remember? He said that because he felt in his heart he didn't win that fight. Let the kids heal, and let's get it on." Three days after the back-and-forth battle, Ibarra is still steamed about the outcome and plans to follow through on protesting the decision with the Nevada State Athletic Commission. While he gives Griffin credit for employing a strong fight plan, Ibarra can't grasp the scoring of round one, calling the fact that two judges scored the round for Griffin "ludicrous." Judges Adalaide Byrd and Roy Silbert gave the first five minutes to Griffin by a 10-9 score, despite Jackson knocking Griffin down and appearing to control the action. "My grounds (for protest) are the first round -- how it was scored," Ibarra said. "I want them to prove to me how a round is to be scored, per the rules that the judges have to follow, and tell me how they came up with what they came up with. I thought the worst nightmare in the world could have been a draw, but a loss unanimously … I can't swallow it. I can't swallow it." Ibarra says his advice to Jackson in the rematch would be to mix it up with Griffin more by using a double jab and trying to get inside to throw more punches. That was something that became increasingly difficult to do Saturday night due to Griffin's effectiveness with the leg kicks. As for Ibarra's pre-fight promise to retire if Griffin pulled the upset, he had this to say: "I'm not going anywhere. I don't go against my word, but look at the video. Did it say I'm retiring from the fight game? No. You know what I'm retiring from? The waterfront. I've been a longshoreman for 28 years. I'm retiring from the waterfront." You'll find him in the gym.</div>
so really... who won the Title fight. Well it depends on who you ask <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>“I might be a little biased because Forrest is a good friend and training partner, but in my opinion Forrest won the fight hands down, three rounds to two. He outworked him from beginning to end, and even though not everything he threw landed, at least he fought the whole time instead of just looking for one big shot. You know, Forrest trained hard for this fight and it showed. He was training in the gym everyday, not running around with a chain around his neck, telling people he’s a thug.” — Mac Danzig, to Sherdog “Look…to me, Quinton beat Forrest, but they gave it to Forrest. I think the UFC wants a champion that Chuck Liddell can beat, so he can win the belt again. He is an ex-champion, sells more and has more marketing.” — Lyoto Machida, to Tatame</div>
LOL at Lyoto, telling it how it is. But Chuck beating Forrest isn't a given (neither is Chuck beating Rashad!).
I disagree about chuck vs rashad.. unless Chuck has lost a gear, Rashad is exactly the type of fighter he beats (wreslter with so-so stand up game). Forrest can take a lick, but Chuck won't let himself be chopped down by leg kicks like Rampage and Chuck still has the most powerful punch at LHW IMO. I'd love to see that match up.. then again there's about 30 potential matchups at LHW I'd love to see
I don't know if I would agree with you celticfan, about not letting himself get dropped with kicks. He is more than willing to take a kick, and he doesn't really block them well. That was a leading factor for why he lost to Keith Jardine, was because he allowed Jardine to keep kicking him in that right leg, if you remember he had a welt the size of a softball on that leg. So I do think that the leg kick will be an effective tool against Chuck in a fight. I think Griffin has a decent chance to beat Chuck in a fight based on that.
I think if Chuck does ultimately get his title match with Griffin he would of learned to defend the leg kicks. I mean his loss to Jardine and then watching Rampage lose because of the leg kicks he has to get a hint, unless hes the cockiest person in the world.
I actually think Rashad would have a good chance against him. He can wrestle and packs power in his punches, he is big for a 205er.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Lavalamp @ Jul 9 2008, 10:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I actually think Rashad would have a good chance against him. He can wrestle and packs power in his punches, he is big for a 205er.</div> If chuck stuffed Randy Couture's take down's.. he's going to easily stuff Rashad's and once you get Chuck down, he's going to get back up. Rashad will not outstrike Chuck either. So unless age is catching up with Chuck, and his defeat of Wand says it's not, I do not see Rashad winning the fight. Heck Dana and Chuck are friends, you think this match was made for Chuck to lose? Rashad is a legit top LHW but his style is exactly the style Chuck has been feasting on for the last 3-4 years.
Well if Chuck and Dana are friends, he didn't do Chuck a favour giving him Rashad. I think he will hang with Chuck standing. Like Rashad has fought some stand up guys. Rashad beat Bisping and Stephan Bonner. Chuck and Rashad have two common opponents, Tito and Jardine. Rashad and Tito tied after a lot of standup. Chuck and Tito was very close to a decision, but Chuck caught him and finished it with 1 minute left, but Tito was standing up with him for 14 minutes. Chuck and Jardine Jardine just outfought him, and Rashad beat Jardine in The Ultimate Fighter 2. I think Rashad will be able to stand with him and will be able to do some damage. Rashad has power and does like stand up fights.
