Warrior's To Do List

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting REREM:</div><div class="quote_post">Carmelo Anthony,Chris Webber,Grant Hill, Magic Johnson,P Ewing,Walton,Olajowon,Jordan,Worthy,Maurice Lucas,Jerry Lucas,Kareem,Bill Russell,Okeafor--all won the NCAA and did well as pros. None came outta nowhere,all were good,but so was May-look at the numbers for the season.</div>
College ball is definitely not my domain even though I do watch the players being mentioned in the draft, but there seems to be a lot of "star" players beyond the #13 pick I jest, there's a lot of solid picks. Even though there's some players we may like because of their solidness, if they are projected to go later, why not trade down and try to shed a bad contract at the same time? I'm a bit clear as to what the future plan would be in drafting the blue collar, great attitude role player, rather than trying to improve the talent to the point where we have a couple guys who cannot be taken out of the game because they're too much of a mismatch wherever you put them. Kind of like how guys like T-Mac and Tim Duncan always manage to find a way to score because there's hardly an answer for them. I see that in Pietrus, Zarko, Jrich, Baron and maybe some other guys if they find out a way to use their size/strength/IQ more to their advantage since they lack speed.

I think part of the reason there's sometimes such a strong reaction to guys like Diogu or May (especially by other team forums), is that they aren't looking for guys they project as being just "solid", they want more coming from the higher pick. If they prove everybody wrong, the team who drafted him wins. But if they lose, they look really bad, especially if the team dives for the next couple of years. We're lucky in that we are not going to be a lotto team much longer if we stay healthy and we have the #9 pick. It means we can do almost anything, so why should we change the mentality of going for the high risk, high reward pick? I mean it's choosing between a free Toyoto Camry versus a free Ferrari Testarossa. It's a huge loss if the Testarossa doesn't even start up and may never work, but it sure doesn't look that bad if you had picked the Camry that doesn't work and somebody else picked the Testarossa and is driving away home happy.

Foyle - led to some team getting T-mac
Fuller - led to missing out on a lot of good picks including Kobe Bryant/Peja Stojakavic
Joe Smith - this is arguable, but we still missed out on a bunch of great picks that were higher risk than a guy who had one good year at Maryland.

Good in college, doesn't always mean good in the NBA. I think that's the lesson we've learned as Warrior fans, just as much as Cavs/Nuggets fans learned with their picks in Diop, Wagner, Tskitishvilli, don't fall into draft hype, either. At least if Diop became the next Shaq, Skita became the next Dirk, and Wagner became the next Jason Terry or Allen Iverson it's all on the player, rather than on the team that drafted them since those guys had all the tools to be good, but just couldn't live up to the expectations.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting REREM:</div><div class="quote_post">Carmelo Anthony,Chris Webber,Grant Hill, Magic Johnson,P Ewing,Walton,Olajowon,Jordan,Worthy,Maurice Lucas,Jerry Lucas,Kareem,Bill Russell,Okeafor--all won the NCAA and did well as pros. None came outta nowhere,all were good,but so was May-look at the numbers for the season.</div>

What I meant is that the guy who wasn't considered as a top prospect before tourney but raised their stock in tourney performance. Players you mentioned were already top prospects who did we in tourney as well. Even if they had poor performance, they would have drafted as they were, or possibly one or two lower pick. In constrast, guys like May were considered as low first rounder at best before tourney begin. But, with tourney performance, he suddenly can be middle first rounder...

 

Actually,we are looking at a time lag type deal. A scout would have seen the same May in midseason or ACC tourney and had his opinion,A Mock-Site reacts slower,needs a bigger push to alter it's prior estimates,to get feedback,hear rumors and in this case to even assume May enters the draft pool,which seemed less likely earlier.
If there is a 10 sec clip or a hazy rumor about Petro,Splitter or another seldom seen Euro,Mock-site rankings can swing up or down 5-10 slots overnight. A scout who went there,got his impressions at the source,meanwhile is giving no thought to a small video clip. To some,that fragment of a look is more than we had and can alter our view,but it won't much change the real draft day results. May probably got some points for clutch play and stamina by going the distance in the NCAA's. McCants probably slipped further from the lottery.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting custodianrules2:</div><div class="quote_post">College ball is definitely not my domain even though I do watch the players being mentioned in the draft, but there seems to be a lot of "star" players beyond the #13 pick I jest, there's a lot of solid picks. Even though there's some players we may like because of their solidness, if they are projected to go later, why not trade down and try to shed a bad contract at the same time? I'm a bit clear as to what the future plan would be in drafting the blue collar, great attitude role player, rather than trying to improve the talent to the point where we have a couple guys who cannot be taken out of the game because they're too much of a mismatch wherever you put them. Kind of like how guys like T-Mac and Tim Duncan always manage to find a way to score because there's hardly an answer for them. I see that in Pietrus, Zarko, Jrich, Baron and maybe some other guys if they find out a way to use their size/strength/IQ more to their advantage since they lack speed.

I think part of the reason there's sometimes such a strong reaction to guys like Diogu or May (especially by other team forums), is that they aren't looking for guys they project as being just "solid", they want more coming from the higher pick. If they prove everybody wrong, the team who drafted him wins. But if they lose, they look really bad, especially if the team dives for the next couple of years. We're lucky in that we are not going to be a lotto team much longer if we stay healthy and we have the #9 pick. It means we can do almost anything, so why should we change the mentality of going for the high risk, high reward pick? I mean it's choosing between a free Toyoto Camry versus a free Ferrari Testarossa. It's a huge loss if the Testarossa doesn't even start up and may never work, but it sure doesn't look that bad if you had picked the Camry that doesn't work and somebody else picked the Testarossa and is driving away home happy.

Foyle - led to some team getting T-mac
Fuller - led to missing out on a lot of good picks including Kobe Bryant/Peja Stojakavic
Joe Smith - this is arguable, but we still missed out on a bunch of great picks that were higher risk than a guy who had one good year at Maryland.

Good in college, doesn't always mean good in the NBA. I think that's the lesson we've learned as Warrior fans, just as much as Cavs/Nuggets fans learned with their picks in Diop, Wagner, Tskitishvilli, don't fall into draft hype, either. At least if Diop became the next Shaq, Skita became the next Dirk, and Wagner became the next Jason Terry or Allen Iverson it's all on the player, rather than on the team that drafted them since those guys had all the tools to be good, but just couldn't live up to the expectations.</div>
I like to look for a well rounded set of skills,no fatal flaws,some quality than will translate to the next level,the work habits-attitudes to indicate a guy will dedicate to more improvement,some aspect that will make a guy a strong matchup in the NBA,A trend toward adding skills,physical tools,smarts,efficiency as a shooter/scorer,some moments,moves,I saw that made me say'"that was special".
I also consider whether he appears overrated-underrated and could be had in a slot we own or can get. I consider his potential primary and secondary roles as a Warrior-and if there is a third role,as for guys like Granger or Hodge,that's a plus too. I give thought to what a guy ought to do as a year 1-2 guy,and what the worst case/best case scenarios are. I juggle what info,stats,visual impressions I have, blend all the above and usually end up with a few guys who I am VERY positive about,and several who really missed the boat by so much I dread the W's might pick them. I know that if I focus too much on a position of need-in a draft weak at that slot,there is a big risk of getting a journeyman when a star was available. I know mocks are a rough guide and sometimes obviously way off-that some teams are pretty clueless, and make blunders anyone should have seen coming. I know guys who appear to have all the right stuff-change or regress,while others change,but for the best. I know you can hear something,a bit short on details that may-or not-be a red flag.
As the assorted Euro-imports are guys I have not seen play,and what stats they have say nothing about their game,except to look pretty uninspiring,and ALL I have left are some mixed reviews from sources who might be idiots-wizards or in between-and then a LOT of recycled second had impressions of those vague reviews-I tend to NOT assume what I don't know and won't advocate a guy about who I know zip. The opinion of anyone else who does not KNOW zip,doesn't persuade me. With Yao,there was more than the usual amount of info,so I could get some ideas. Some HS prospects I get a basic idea on,some I don't. If nothing else,US HS prospects have full time stats so you can see who gets rebounds,who shoots high %,but level of competition can be variable. It all adds up to playing the percentages as nobody has a time machine.

 

Ike is not even projected to come out this year...

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Warriorfansnc93:</div><div class="quote_post">Ike is not even projected to come out this year...</div>

Hm, don't tell Ike that...

http://www.draftcity.com/dcdaily.php?p=283

 

He could stay one year and finish up early to get his degree. You never know if it could be a cultural/family values thing like with Emeka Okafor's upbringing and the emphasis on the importance of education. I think him and Ike are both of Nigerian descent, but orrect me if I'm wrong on that. But it's a possibility the parents might be leaning on Diogu to stay or have raised Diogu in such a way to make himself want to stay. People say you can always go back later, but it's a lot harder if you drop out and try to pick up where you left off.

 

If I have a million bucks I could hire a proffessor as a personal tutor. I recall seeing where his mother corrected a rumor he pulled out,said he remains declared. I've seen him listed at various points round 1 and have said before,I would not be very surprised if he went earlier than #9,though,I'd find it cool if I could feel sure he'd last to 12 or 13,as a trade down could then gain us a bonus. The Clips have pick 12 and a very early # 2-which could become Dwayne Jones or Salim Stoudamire.

 

Ike's stat sheet looks really impressive and his scouting reports make him sound as good of a pick after Andrew Bogut. Only weakness is Ike is not that big to play power forward and he's not that fast to play small forward. I don't even think he's faster than Dunleavy. It's hit or miss with that guy, since he'll be the same type of player for better or worse. I mean it's like with Dunleavy, the guy can't get faster. He can get stronger and play a little more aggressive, but his upside is pretty limited to spend the #9 on. If any team did draft Digou sooner than #9, it'd probably be Rob Babcock's pick

I just think it's dangerous to pick Diogu that early and expect him to be Elton Brand or our version of Shawn Marion or whoever was compared as a 6'7 power forward.

 

A lot of athletes who declared early actually continued their degree during the summer or by correspondence if there are classes that allow that. The most famous example is Vince Carter, who perhaps blew Game 7 of the Eastern Finals by going to his graduation. James Worthy, Michael Jordan, J.R. Reid, Jerry Stackhouse, and Antawn Jamison also did it among many other athletes. Since Ike's already a junior he's probably only got a few classes left, unless he's been slacking.

 

Wow these Tarheel athletes are a shining example of being winners when it comes to getting that degree. Unlike those Cincinatti Bearcats

 

I think Shaq finally got his degree.
I'm quite sure Diogu is a step quicker than Dunleavy,and he was quicker,noticibly,this year than last. Being quick,strong,skilled and big enough is what it take to score 23,about 10 boards and get to the line a. lot.He often was double teamed by a tall guy and a quick guy-and got the basket-and one. That his D was sweet is why I rant on about him. Sheldon Williams had been my guy,as the best D in college,but Ike was close-and more versatile on offense,so I switched. Who would you prefer,S Marion or Rodney white? White is 3" taller,but at even PF,Marion is better.
Diogu is one of the players who WORK HARD,who PLAY HARD,who are in this draft-and he is a very athletic,skilled player. That is the type who quickly adjusts to the NBA game and keeps getting better while others,who focus only on a few things,or don't focus at all,who party in the offseason and don't go all out on the floor-wind up as backups. "potential" is not just size/speed/vertical leap/hits a 3 sometimes. The will and intensity in the game,and preparing for the season is vital. Diogu was a much improved player this year because he worked hard in the offseason.
Watching Spurs-Sonics...what the hell got into Jerome James lately? He showed little progress for several years and suddenly is playing real well.

 

Looks like there's a bunch of team's interested in Green so unless we do well on the draft order selection tonight, we might have to look at possibilities of other guard/forwards like Martell Webster/Danny Granger and others.

It doesn't apear Mullin will go for a power forward at #9, but maybe he would if there were a trade to get a mid first round selection. Most of the pure power forwards have been second rounds or the tweeners have been converted to play small forward because they're athletic enough to do a lot more things. I don't think Diogu fits that bill because he's not athletic enough and he lacks shot range. He maybe more athletic than Dunleavy, but c'mon that's not saying much. Dunleavy, if it weren't for his basketball sense, would not even be a starter in this league because he's got no explosiveness and he's still a work in progress with his catch and shoot game. Ideally, dunleavy is the guy you want to move with the ball and come off screens for the midrange shot since he's taller/longer than everybody else and can move/shoot well off the dribble/and get it off fluidly. Nothing against Diogu, but he's projected in some scouts eyes to be a version of Kenny Thomas. It's not bad to have a player like that, but at the same time would you draft such a player where we're drafting at #9? This feels like the debate against drafting Jameer Nelson at #11 because if the heigh factor and the fact there were more players with greater upside left on the board. Jameer is talented, he's quick, has court vision and has bulk and IMO would have been an upgrade over Speedy at the time. I think he'll do better than expected, but aren't we glad we took Biedrins instead? Biedrins was projected #5 but he fell down to #11 so we lucked out. If there's another player that is projected by scouts to go top 5 but he falls, I hope we get him. I think Digou isn't even projected anywhere near that and judging by the type of roster the W's want to build it should be a guard/forward manning the 3 and not a small forward/power forward like the one we already have in Zarko Cabarkapa.

Diogu will be a good player, but there's other players out there that can probably emulate what he does and could be bigger or quicker than he is maybe in the 2nd round. Courtvision is hard to find and size is something hard to find, so I would definitely rate certain college players on having one or the other in order to make others better or gain some sort of dominance on the physical level as well as the talent side.

 

Custodian,you adopted the nickname of a guy who is an "undersize,Not that Quick" F,and we know Cardinal can play. Diogu can play. I saw it. I would have given up and given in and said,yeah,Taft,or Petro,but I know I saw teams double team him with big men...and he scored,boarded and the chumps guarding him fouyled out. He led the whole damn NCAA in FT made-and scored 23 per,had nice rbd numbers-even hit 3's,get that Kenny Thomas junk outta here,Thomas is good,but not as much zoom,envision a bigger S Marion,or a compact A Stoudamire,thats what I saw and I know it would be a big plus for the W's. These Mock sites expected Martynas A to be Kareem,or at least Sabonis...and the punk failed to average 2 pt per game...that ain't upside-that's called a hoax. We HAVE G/F types available for the 3,even if Dunleavy was traded,whether it's Pietrus (my keyboard has a thing about Pietrus-always wants to skip the E,but only on his name?????) or J Rich. We also might grab J Hodge as a rd 2 steal. Diogu can be a muscle guy at 3,a quick guy at 4. At either role,he'd play better D than who we have. We do not need a guy who is 6-11 for PF if he sucks,or a lean 6-9 SF if he sucks...which is why none of us are saying give R White a bigger role and keep Shika. We need talent. As the top scorer(not counting small-school guys) in the draft,and a guy with all-round game-why is he not TALENT? If we take some stiff-and Diogu has a great rookie year elsewhere,Y'all know I'll be mentioning that...and Y'all know what a pain I can be if I'm sure of something. It's too bad everyone doesn't have a tape of the Arizona-Arizona St OT game. I'm tired of fussing about this

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting REREM:</div><div class="quote_post">Custodian,you adopted the nickname of a guy who is an "undersize,Not that Quick" F,and we know Cardinal can play.
</div> Yeah, but even I wouldn't draft him at #9... Sorry I'm taking things out of context, but you're right, effective. Also I'm well aware that Cardinal gets owned by some power forward matchups and outquicked by small forwards, so I worry about that type of weakness in Diogu. But hey gotta love the guy that doesn't look anything like a baller, but still is exciting to watch because of the extra effort, the "willing to do anything" style of play, and his points usually come at a good time even though he is reluctant to shoot the ball.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting REREM:</div><div class="quote_post">
Diogu can play. I saw it. I would have given up and given in and said,yeah,Taft,or Petro,but I know I saw teams double team him with big men...and he scored,boarded and the chumps guarding him fouyled out. He led the whole damn NCAA in FT made-and scored 23 per,had nice rbd numbers-even hit 3's,get that Kenny Thomas junk outta here,Thomas is good,but not as much zoom,envision a bigger S Marion,or a compact A Stoudamire,thats what I saw and I know it would be a big plus for the W's. These Mock sites expected Martynas A to be Kareem,or at least Sabonis...and the punk failed to average 2 pt per game...that ain't upside-that's called a hoax. We HAVE G/F types available for the 3,even if Dunleavy was traded,whether it's Pietrus (my keyboard has a thing about Pietrus-always wants to skip the E,but only on his name?????) or J Rich. We also might grab J Hodge as a rd 2 steal. Diogu can be a muscle guy at 3,a quick guy at 4. At either role,he'd play better D than who we have. We do not need a guy who is 6-11 for PF if he sucks,or a lean 6-9 SF if he sucks...which is why none of us are saying give R White a bigger role and keep Shika. We need talent. As the top scorer(not counting small-school guys) in the draft,and a guy with all-round game-why is he not TALENT? If we take some stiff-and Diogu has a great rookie year elsewhere,Y'all know I'll be mentioning that...and Y'all know what a pain I can be if I'm sure of something. It's too bad everyone doesn't have a tape of the Arizona-Arizona St OT game. I'm tired of fussing about this</div> All right, I didn't mean to upset you about the Kenny Thomas comparrison. I don't know what to say. I just think the college game and the nba game don't tell the whole story at times if the matchups in the NBA don't work out

It's like the cup is empty, the cup is half full. You're optimistic about Ike Diogu's offensive talent. Strong at small forward, quick at power forward. I see him as slow at small forward and outmatched at power forward. I tend to be a little bit pessimistic. But he does have an excellent college game. I talk about his game and how he's the next best polished big next to Andrew Bogut with the third guy being Channing Frye. All those guys are all-around players. But I'm just not convinced the matchup will put them in a good situation when everybody is just so much bigger and stronger and quicker. Dunleavy was an all around player, won the NCAA, was hyped up by Warrior fans when we got the #3 as a guy that can do everything well at that size. I just couldn't buy into it because he was slow and looked really weak. I am okay with him now, but I'm pessimistic that I only see in Diogu what I saw in Dunleavy in terms of matchups. I'm not saying Diogu is Dunleavy, but they could get exploited in a lot of matchups to take away their playing time.

Even with all these players we drafted over the years there was no player that could dominate on both ends, and even Ike Diogu will have to sacrifice defense for offense or offense for defense when there's other prospects who might be able to do both and more. That's all I'm saying. Giving size and all that length is tough. Even these undersized power forwards like Brian Cardinal and Eduardo Najera that play big find themselves in some coach's doghouse because they can't find ways to utilize them as much as the guys who can matchup with the other team on a game to game basis.

If he becomes Elton Brand I'll mention it everytime on this board when Ike gets mentioned that REREM was right. But for now this is my first draft with you so we'll see who is a good judge and seer of nba talent. I've been with several drafts with some of the other guys on this board and they were calling Biedrins or Pavel Podkolzine
or Josh Smith
or Al jefferson
or Jameer Nelson

All that matters is who Mullin picks, if it gets results, the team is happy with it, because damn it's not like we have any control of who they take. That would be cool, though if Mullin drops by and goes Diogu, good idea REREM. I then hope he also sees how I called him out earlier in the year. Maybe he'll show Dunleavy Jr. my current sig

Dunleavy you da man! Anyway REREM I like your posts, I like your passion, but I guess I'd have to be in your shoes as a college bball expert to really see where you're coming from. Also, honestly I can say that I have no clue who the Warriors should take, I'm trying to leave the stats out of it but look at what the skillset is and what type of body they have as well as desire. It's really up in the air. There's guy that look good based on potential like Kwame Brown or Nikolov Tskitshilli or guys that were good on paper but didn't produce like Marcus Fizer or Rodney White (18ppg freshman year).
But anyway, REREM I like your input, very informative.

 

You gotta realize I'm a draft freak going way way back,I had opinions and lists on basketball and football drafts going back to the 70's...and sometimes further. When I first watched the NBA the game was in black + white,and the Warriors were in Philly.

I have seen many teams screw up,and the most common screw up is when a team gets desperate for a big man and picks a lazy player or one with less basketball IQ than the basketball itself. Often these guys can pop an ouside J when wide open,or run with some grace,or have an "NBA BODY",but there are big red flags,things they fail to do,things stats reveal as a hard cold bottom line.

Dunleavy ,for instance,is about the player I expected he'd be...which would about fit as a pick around #20 most drafts. There was a popular conception he was a deadeye shooter and a great passing F who could play big. Those are his qualities,but just not that much.
I liked Wade who has come on strong,he got tagged as undersize but seemed to find creative ways to score,and in college,looked like a veteran pro already.
However,I also liked Joe Smith who in college played with much more passion and energy and was better on D. It's hard to anticipate the guy who once he has a big bank account,gets soft.
I once wondered whether 6-5 Elgin Baylor could be a good F. Now I believe a really good player can give up a few inches and still dominate his matchup. Watching Diogu this year I especially noticed he was much quicker than last year,and he is noticably quicker than Dunleavy. Granger is sneaky quick,a smooth glide a nifty move and a subtle spurt and he has the space he needs. Watch Diogu in a game and he makes the 6-10 guys look small,he takes control. Kenyon Martin did that in college too. A U Cinn,current player Maxiel plays much bigger than his measured 6-7.

I have gone off on major rants about Marvin Williams. What a remarkablr physical athlete he is...yet his rebounding apathy is sad,his D only happens in spurts and He has no idea of how to use his strength inside vs big men. Marvin at least showed flashes and IF he decides to play hard,might live up to the hype in a few years. Some team is going to expect much more,much sooner. Seeing at least 5-6 NC games,the Marvin-May contrast really messed with my head. May was pretty much creating a video textbook on how to play in the paint...Marvin was snoozing through the lesson. In the finals,Marvin got a bit motivated and actually played respectable D for the first time I'd seen-but clanked his outside shots,so some said he had a dissapointing game,yet I thought it was better than most. May however dominated,as had been the case through NC' tournament run. Felton also earned a lottery spot,while McCant's mediocre D and streaky shooting hurt him. Despite the visible reality,many assume Marvin is the next superstar and May is a whole inch shy of being as able as Chris Taft who's skills mainly involve backing down much smaller guys. I keep hearing people claim May is too fat...he's dropped 40-50lb in 3 yr....yet they meanwhile assume Martynas can add 30 pounds of power,elevate his skills from JV to NBA this decade and become a force. Reality is May may not be the right guy here,but would not be the worst pick by far. 7-0,7-3,7-5,7-9 whatever,a guy needs some abilities. Bol and Bradley were to physically weak,without much quickness. There must be a dozen guys 7-0 or more currently riding bench in the NBA....and 6-10 C's Amare and Ben W are still in the playoffs.
I get a bit over excited when some folks say Diogu is not better than F Vasquez...because NBA Draft.Net says so....or because he's too tweener to small for PF,too slow for SF,when I have seen otherwise and I suspect some folks didn't see the guy play. I figure others never saw Warrick,as they echo an outdated "internet review that is nothing like his game. Frye got described as like Camby. Actually,Camby is a pretty effective player,but Camby came into the NBA a 6-11 210lb jumping jack. Frye is 245-250,a bit more well rounded but not as much a big play guy. Frye was skinny as a freshman,but is a SR now.
Martell Webster's name comes up some,often as a G. He's 6-6 235,and while pretty mobile,at that size I expect he'd have a good shot as a SF,would need to drop 10-15lb to be quick enough to shine at G. He can shoot.
I wish I could check out Andrew Bynum's game in detail. Rumor is he shed some more weight. At 7-0 and 290+ he actually moved well in the McD game,but at 280 or less he'd be quicker,yet still a power guy. To me,there is some real upside in him and less risk than I see in others. The words "lazy" and "underachiever" didn't come to my mind when I saw him. I'm pretty stoked about all the good players who are said to be round 2. I do expect the "mock" consensus will not match up to the real draft as much as assumed,and several guys pegged as rd 2 will go earlier,while some of the speculation "potential" types will drop. NBA Draft.net,and others started the season expecting some guys to have a breakthrough...and many did not. Had a guy like Splitter had a somewhat better year,the progress factor would have said something,same for several others. Martynas had to show SOME progress. Nobody wants to have the probability he never even reaches mediocre,and progress matters.
Fran Vargas 22 yr old...about the same age as Larry Roberts. Can Vargas match Roberts as a scorer? Rebounder? You could make a case that Roberts is pretty far ahead. Size? 1' and 5lb seperates them. So what makes Vargas a legit top 10 if Roberts is not even a high #2????
I have never seen a draft so wierd as this one,and there have been strange picks in recent years. I hope when the W's pick,it is wise,well informed and not banking on rumors and speculations about who is alleged to rank where. The bopttom line is always we add a talent who helps us the most.

 

Fair enough, REREM. Those are all good points that for some reason I didn't consider right away (i.e. drafts I haven't even lived through, the trendiness of the draft in recent times, the whole bandwagon effect). I wouldn't mind Ike Diogu, but I also wasn't hyping up or supporting Fran Vasquez or Chris Taft or the 7'3" guy as the guy to take in the draft in any way. I simply said I wouldn't mind them since it's no loss if they jack up because they probably wouldn't crack the rotations in their first years anyway. However, guys I think that could produce right away happen to be college seniors with not as much upside as the players above. I think Danny Granger can contribute right away with some additional weight training and I think Splitter (not a college senior) could possibly jump right in at power forward. Heck, if Pau can do it, so might he. I like the guys with size, offense and defense + tenacity. I don't really care much about their stats or anything, but their ability to make other teams better. I feel guys that can match up, stay with their man, not get shoved off the block (well, ignore Splitter on this), score some, defend some, make their teammates better.

Also nbadraft.net is kind of a joke, but it's interesting to see what they do and
just so you know Granger/Splitter are the guys I'm following right now. Petro is also a player of interest along with Bynum (Magloire/Brendon Haywood like). I'm not sure about Martell Webster, but he sounds decent. 6'7 235 is pretty decent for a high schooler. I'm okay with Ike Diogu, but #9 is putting the guy in a Dunleavy type position. He might not be consistent despite kicking butt in college because of the matchup problems going against him. Sure he may play bigger in college, but in the NBA there's a big chance he may not. There's only one Elton Brand in the NBA. The other guys like Al Jefferson, Zach Randolph, Mike Sweetney, 6'8 guys that aren't quite the athletes seem to struggle in the open court or the transition game or weakside D. I'm not saying that Ike Diogu may be a lousy defender in the NBA, but he may be an inconsistent defender.