<div class="quote_poster">upsidedownside7 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I can't believe you guys crapping on Harrington, he played awesome. His shot was falling, he was finishing at the basket, running the break, even passed the ball a few times. How in the world is that one dimensional? He went for 30 while shooting ABOVE .50%. Harrington didn't rebound the ball at all but Biedrins wasn't much better. Only guy who stepped up in that department was Pietrus. I actually thought he played better defense than Murphy or Dunleavy ever did against the Lakers. Notice his hands and how no unknown scrubs had a career night playing us like Walton or Turiaf. Nobody scored more than 15 except Kobe. AL definitley needs to grab more boards, 1 is horrible, but he deserves credit for carrying us in the game. Be happy you turned Murphy and Dunleavy into a capable NBA starter let alone two...seriously. The result of the game sucked and we really need to trade a wing for a big guy that can rebound. Old squad would have lost the game a lot sooner then late in the 4th. We're clearly better but I don't know if that's good enough. We definitley need a backup guy that can rebound at the 4/5. Without that, Biedrins is all alone in there. I liked Josh Powell a lot. Tough young guy. I'd absolutely keep him and look for another guy that can do the same. Foyle should never play and apparently Nelson agrees because he went with Powell over Foyle during the 2nd half. Sarunas will be okay. He's a high risk type of player but he's capable of making plays. Give him time to get acclimated to the other guys on the squad. He did have a horrific stretch of basketball but whatever... Jackson defended Kobe as well as you could and certainly better than Pietrus. He didn't play with as much intensity but I like him more than Dunleavy.</div> Agree 100% with these comments.
It's going to take awhile for these guys to learn each other's games. They haven't played or practiced together much. Honestly, I was surprised to see them playing that much and as well as they have.
Btw kensaku, I'm just venting. I took the loss hard that's all. http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap;_ylt=At2...7012213&prov=ap Harrington holds himself accountable. And yes Biedrins didn't do so hot on the glass because he got outmuscled and was in a lot of foul trouble.
<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Btw kensaku, I'm just venting. I took the loss hard that's all. http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap;_ylt=At2...7012213&prov=ap Harrington holds himself accountable. And yes Biedrins didn't do so hot on the glass because he got outmuscled and was in a lot of foul trouble.</div> hahaha, it's cool. The loss sucked...each game we lose, we just keep digging our own grave. I'm glad Harrington is holding himself accountable for the piss poor rebounding performance. A lot of things were going right early on and it all fell apart. I miss J-Rich.
<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> All I'm saying is we need to find more ways to win rather than find more of the same way we always try to win.</div> Trust me, having Baron suspended on Saturday and then out for the last five minutes of last night's game is not going to be the way the Warriors plan to win the rest of the season. I am going to be as optimistic as Don Nelson. I think if you are more optimistic than he is, then of course you will be a little bummed about the last two games. I'll trust Don Nelson when he says that this roster will be pretty darned good. It's just going to take some time before it gels into a playoff lock team in the Western Confrence. I strongly disagree with the comments or thoughts about trading Biedrins or Monta Ellis because they are too small. Now if we can trade them for Kevin Garnett then I will be down with that. But to trade them because they are too small, doesn't seem like a good long term fix. Biedrins will get stronger. Also the Warriors have Foyle and hopefully at some point Patrick O'Bryant to add the big bodies, which seems much more efficient than trading Biedrins for someone like Bynum or Okur who would not fit the Warriors' building process or system. I can understand being upset and frustrated with losing these close games. But I cannot understand or support trading the best players on the team because we all want to say what each player lacks and blame it on them that the team is not a playoff team yet. I mean some have gone so extreme to point out faults that they are upset with Harrington after last night's game, what is that about? We should not consider trading Biedrins because he is small compared to three other centers in the league (well maybe about 5 if we add Shaq and Yao). Look at the Detroit Pistons when they were champions. I am sure people could point out tons of areas that players like Billups, Hamilton, Prince, Rasheed Wallace, Ben Wallace and even the head coach Larry Brown lacked in, individually (I mean Larry Brown went from hero to bum in almost two years I think). I know people can find a whole bunch of areas where the Lakers' squad has faults and aren't great at. Do they have a 20/10 block shot player on their team this season? Not that I know of. But they have played with each other for many years (well for today's NBA standards) and they know how to get the job done. They know their system and how they are going to succeed. We can look at all the other top teams in the NBA and find faults and holes. I know people didn't have much faith in players like Jason Terry, Boris Diaw, Steve Nash, Shawn Marion, Jason Williams, and many others who now play huge roles on winning teams. Where are the Warriors in the path to becoming a team like this? They are at the very beginning. Players like Mike Bibby, Chris Webber, Vlade Divac, and Peja would never be seen as an all-star team or a complete team before they formed their system with Adelman. But they fit in the system, the perfect system for their team and they formed a very strong team that almost reached the finals for quite a few years. Trust Don Nelson. He knows how teams are built. And when he says that the team is not there yet (because of young players, inexperience, and lack of experience playing together as a team), I have a hard time disagreeing with him. Who would know better than Nelson? Maybe Phil Jackson, but that's about it.
<div class="quote_poster">Clif25 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Trust me, having Baron suspended on Saturday and then out for the last five minutes of last night's game is not going to be the way the Warriors plan to win the rest of the season. I am going to be as optimistic as Don Nelson. I think if you are more optimistic than he is, then of course you will be a little bummed about the last two games. I'll trust Don Nelson when he says that this roster will be pretty darned good. It's just going to take some time before it gels into a playoff lock team in the Western Confrence. I strongly disagree with the comments or thoughts about trading Biedrins or Monta Ellis because they are too small. Now if we can trade them for Kevin Garnett then I will be down with that. But to trade them because they are too small, doesn't seem like a good long term fix. Biedrins will get stronger. Also the Warriors have Foyle and hopefully at some point Patrick O'Bryant to add the big bodies, which seems much more efficient than trading Biedrins for someone like Bynum or Okur who would not fit the Warriors' building process or system. I can understand being upset and frustrated with losing these close games. But I cannot understand or support trading the best players on the team because we all want to say what each player lacks and blame it on them that the team is not a playoff team yet. I mean some have gone so extreme to point out faults that they are upset with Harrington after last night's game, what is that about? We should not consider trading Biedrins because he is small compared to three other centers in the league (well maybe about 5 if we add Shaq and Yao). Look at the Detroit Pistons when they were champions. I am sure people could point out tons of areas that players like Billups, Hamilton, Prince, Rasheed Wallace, Ben Wallace and even the head coach Larry Brown lacked in, individually (I mean Larry Brown went from hero to bum in almost two years I think). I know people can find a whole bunch of areas where the Lakers' squad has faults and aren't great at. Do they have a 20/10 block shot player on their team this season? Not that I know of. But they have played with each other for many years (well for today's NBA standards) and they know how to get the job done. They know their system and how they are going to succeed. We can look at all the other top teams in the NBA and find faults and holes. I know people didn't have much faith in players like Jason Terry, Boris Diaw, Steve Nash, Shawn Marion, Jason Williams, and many others who now play huge roles on winning teams. Where are the Warriors in the path to becoming a team like this? They are at the very beginning. Players like Mike Bibby, Chris Webber, Vlade Divac, and Peja would never be seen as an all-star team or a complete team before they formed their system with Adelman. But they fit in the system, the perfect system for their team and they formed a very strong team that almost reached the finals for quite a few years. Trust Don Nelson. He knows how teams are built. And when he says that the team is not there yet (because of young players, inexperience, and lack of experience playing together as a team), I have a hard time disagreeing with him. Who would know better than Nelson? Maybe Phil Jackson, but that's about it.</div> You're smart.
<div class="quote_poster">Clif25 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Trust me, having Baron suspended on Saturday and then out for the last five minutes of last night's game is not going to be the way the Warriors plan to win the rest of the season. I am going to be as optimistic as Don Nelson. I think if you are more optimistic than he is, then of course you will be a little bummed about the last two games. I'll trust Don Nelson when he says that this roster will be pretty darned good. It's just going to take some time before it gels into a playoff lock team in the Western Confrence. I strongly disagree with the comments or thoughts about trading Biedrins or Monta Ellis because they are too small. Now if we can trade them for Kevin Garnett then I will be down with that. But to trade them because they are too small, doesn't seem like a good long term fix. Biedrins will get stronger. Also the Warriors have Foyle and hopefully at some point Patrick O'Bryant to add the big bodies, which seems much more efficient than trading Biedrins for someone like Bynum or Okur who would not fit the Warriors' building process or system. I can understand being upset and frustrated with losing these close games. But I cannot understand or support trading the best players on the team because we all want to say what each player lacks and blame it on them that the team is not a playoff team yet. I mean some have gone so extreme to point out faults that they are upset with Harrington after last night's game, what is that about? We should not consider trading Biedrins because he is small compared to three other centers in the league (well maybe about 5 if we add Shaq and Yao). Look at the Detroit Pistons when they were champions. I am sure people could point out tons of areas that players like Billups, Hamilton, Prince, Rasheed Wallace, Ben Wallace and even the head coach Larry Brown lacked in, individually (I mean Larry Brown went from hero to bum in almost two years I think). I know people can find a whole bunch of areas where the Lakers' squad has faults and aren't great at. Do they have a 20/10 block shot player on their team this season? Not that I know of. But they have played with each other for many years (well for today's NBA standards) and they know how to get the job done. They know their system and how they are going to succeed. We can look at all the other top teams in the NBA and find faults and holes. I know people didn't have much faith in players like Jason Terry, Boris Diaw, Steve Nash, Shawn Marion, Jason Williams, and many others who now play huge roles on winning teams. Where are the Warriors in the path to becoming a team like this? They are at the very beginning. Players like Mike Bibby, Chris Webber, Vlade Divac, and Peja would never be seen as an all-star team or a complete team before they formed their system with Adelman. But they fit in the system, the perfect system for their team and they formed a very strong team that almost reached the finals for quite a few years. Trust Don Nelson. He knows how teams are built. And when he says that the team is not there yet (because of young players, inexperience, and lack of experience playing together as a team), I have a hard time disagreeing with him. Who would know better than Nelson? Maybe Phil Jackson, but that's about it.</div> I know this message is addressed to the entire forum and not particularly just at me since I don't support trading Biedrins or Ellis either. They are untouchables thus far. Even Jrich is still off limits IMO unless we're getting Garnett or a top 8 player. I hope to be more optimistic it's just that this run n' gun game just isn't my philosophy, I guess. Neither was halfcourt, but I guess I'm saying balance can still be achievable. With the right mix of power/quickness + smarts and changes of tempo, we could probably do a lot of big things rather than just one thing. And yes I understand Harrington isn't going to save us, but I think his style of game changes the entire chemistry of the team and most nights that won't be good. Fans will grow tired of his game and the only reason he's popular right now was because Murphy and Dunleavy were a lot worse as scorers, despite being notable for better rebounding and more unselfish play. I mean our team could very well be the same format at the 2002 team. Looked great on paper but didn't fit because certain players were not controlling the defensive matchups or offensive mismatches when forced into a halfcourt setting. It's easy to score when you run, but when the other team is serious about preventing guys from leaking out, how can we continue to score? I pray our execution gets better, but these guys may not even like running plays. They just want to run and do streetball or whatever and all the position players are doing the same things rather than adding something different like true inside scoring or ability to work their way to the line. We really don't have guys like that and that was my biggest issue before the trade and after the trade.
<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Even Jrich is still off limits IMO unless we're getting Garnett or a top 8 player.</div> I agree about not wanting to trade JRich, but he's not a top 8 player. He's maybe a top 20 player. So even if we didn't get a superstar, if we got another top 20 player (like AK-47 or Gasol) I'd strongly have to consider it, based upon the current roster make-up. However, I'd first want to give JRich time to come back and have a chance to re-establish himself before I'd trade him. Hopefully that's soon. <div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> With the right mix of power/quickness + smarts and changes of tempo, we could probably do a lot of big things rather than just one thing.</div> I agree. There are times during the game where it is necessary to shift gears or change up th tempo / attack plan. <div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">And yes I understand Harrington isn't going to save us, but I think his style of game changes the entire chemistry of the team and most nights that won't be good. Fans will grow tired of his game and the only reason he's popular right now was because Murphy and Dunleavy were a lot worse as scorers, despite being notable for better rebounding and more unselfish play. </div> The Warriors are better off after the trade. Harrington has barely even set foot in Okaland. IMO let him play for a month or two before condemning his poor chemistry. <div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">but these guys may not even like running plays. They just want to run and do streetball or whatever and all the position players are doing the same things rather than adding something different like true inside scoring or ability to work their way to the line.</div> Jackson, Sarunas, Powell, and Harrington just got here a few days ago. They barely even had time for one practice before they played their first game. Of course they're going to have to improvise / play on instinct until they get the plays down. But further, and most importantly, it's not "these guys" who want to "run and do streetball or whatever." Don Nelson is the coach, and he's one of the most "in-control" coaches in the league. This is his show. He chooses to let baron go completely ad-lib at times. He runs specific plays for Monta / Baron where it's just "give them the ball and get out of the way." That's part of Nelson's plan. At times he runs strict sets, and at others he says "play off what the defense gives you." And about running -- well we all know it's Nelson's instruction to RUN! It's not like the players are just choosing to try to run and do "whatever" -- It's Nelson's command as a leader. We hear him yelling it like fifty times a game: "C'mon, RUN! RUN! Run it back!" There's two issues here: first, the new guys are going to need some time to learn the plays, learn the proper way to run, and develop chemistry. Second, it's part of Nelson's plan to let the players play to their strengths, and just simply create at times. He wouldn't do that with Foyle. He wouldn't say "okay Foyle, here's the ball, just run and do whatever." Because he knows Foyle will fuk it up. But he does do that with Baron, because he knows that sometimes, Baron is at his best when the playbook is used as a seat cushion. I think what Clif25 is saying (very well said, IMO), is that Nellie understands his personell. He understands that it will take time for these players to gel. It's only been a few days with harrington and SJax, so there's no need to climb all over their weaknesses yet. Let this group develop as a team. Nelson knows how to put players in a position to succeed -- afterall he's one of the best coaches in the history of the game. If he says run, I'd say "how fast?"
