What Happened??? The Magic thought they got the better the trade, but no playoffs

If TMac had been injured for a huge chunk of the season, and Cato was 100% this conversation would likely be completely different. (At least the goofy rants earlier in the thread). Add to that if Christie had been the player we thought we were getting, there definitely wouldn't be any of this chatter. TMac was going to split after the season, and we had to get something in return. TMac is a monster talent that can't be denied, but as Weisbrod said ' I'm pretty sure we could've ended up in last place even without TMac '.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Earlier in the season the Magic Organization was braggin on how they got the better of the Houston/ Orlando trade. Well sorry to say that you guys didn't even make the playoffs this year. Not only that, you watched Tmac have the best season of his career as far as stats. Now that you're season was a failure, and your GM quiting, I want to know if you still feel as confident about getting the better of the trade.</div>

You don't have to come into another teams' forum, just to trash them. Sarcasm just annoys people. Like XOver said, had McGrady gone down injured, we would've missed the playoffs. Had Cuttino been in a Magic Jersey at the end of the season, they would've made the playoffs. Weisbrod has always been a dumbass, but it's not like he bought them a ticket to mediocrity with this trade. Replacing your coach with the season winding down was really, really stupid, and trading a potential 18 (or more) ppg scorer for a banged up "defensive" guy was stupid too.

If I was the Magic GM, I would rather have Steve Francis, an Expiring contract in Mobley, and Cato over an uninspired McGrady (which he was at the time), a huge contract in Howard (who is injured right now).

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MrJ:</div><div class="quote_post">I don?t know how the Magic got the short end of the stick in the McGrady deal. I actually liked the deal and thought the Magic could make some noise this season especially with them drafting Dwight Howard. May someone please tell me how it was a bad trade?

When they acquired Steve Francis, Orlando got a consistent starter on the all-star team, and someone who could gave you about 20/6/6.5 a night. Not many players in the NBA can/could stop Francis and Orlando had a player that could basically dismantle any defense especially with the help of his trusty side kick Cuttino ?The Cat? Mobley.

Mobley in addition to being tremendously underrated, is an excellent shooter and plays hard-nosed defense. His presence along with Turkoglu, spread the floor for Steve to thrive off of penetration more efficiently. Dwight Howard is a rising star in the league and was contributing in the post which spread the floor out even more.

With Kelvin Cato, the Magic had a very legit 7-foot center to play along Howard. Their frontcourt was monstrous having two athletic 7-footers blocking shots and rebounding. Cato helped the Magic out plenty and was a key piece to the deal with his defense and size.

When the Magic gave up McGrady, they gave up a superstar that could not fill up all three of these positions at all. While McGrady is better than Francis, Mobley, and Cato, he is not as valuable as all of them meaning his role was not as important as all of them combined. To me, a scoring machine in Steve Francis, a lights out shooter in Mobley, and a shot blocking center is much more valuable than one McGrady.

The Magic didn?t really fail like everyone said they did. Many people believed Orlando would not be in playoff contention and would be headed straight to the top 3 in the lottery. In the beginning of the season, Orlando played really well and was in playoff contention, but the Mobley trade steered them in the wrong direction and that?s why they lost. Please, let?s not forget that Christie only played 21 games for the Magic this season so shortly after the deal was made, they basically got nothing out of it.</div>
First off, you DIDN'T GET THE BETTER OF THE TRADE. Look at it this way, TMac and Yao have one of the brightest futures in the NBA. Juwan Howard was playing the best ball of his career. Both LUV IT in Houston playing for Van Gundy. Tmac and Van Gundy NEVER clashed during the season or the playoffs. As far as Orlando, you made a great draft choice in Howard. But Steve Francis is a problem. First off he's one of the most turnover prone PG'S in the game. He dribbles WAY too much. Third, he's a bad teamate as far as practice and whinning about not getting help. Not to mention, he might get traded this season. All the while, TMac is going to end his career in Houston. So while Orlando has a good nucleus of young talent. I would think as far the Houston/ Orlando trade. You got HOODWINKED!!

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Rockfan06:</div><div class="quote_post">First off, you DIDN'T GET THE BETTER OF THE TRADE. Look at it this way, TMac and Yao have one of the brightest futures in the NBA. Juwan Howard was playing the best ball of his career. Both LUV IT in Houston playing for Van Gundy. Tmac and Van Gundy NEVER clashed during the season or the playoffs. As far as Orlando, you made a great draft choice in Howard. But Steve Francis is a problem. First off he's one of the most turnover prone PG'S in the game. He dribbles WAY too much. Third, he's a bad teamate as far as practice and whinning about not getting help. Not to mention, he might get traded this season. All the while, TMac is going to end his career in Houston. So while Orlando has a good nucleus of young talent. I would think as far the Houston/ Orlando trade. You got HOODWINKED!!</div>
Well the Rockets traded away all of their role players and just thought they could win with Tmac and Yao. They learned in the playoffs that it takes a lot more then two All-Stars to make a team. I don't think the Magic got the better end of the deal but I do think they had a better all around roster at the start of last season. With Grant Hill healthy, Tony Battie being signed, Jameer Nelson and Dwight Howard being drafted and with Hedo Turkoglu coming off the bench I felt we had better role players then the Rockets and there lack of help for Tmac and Yao would kill them. I think the Magic had a better offseason then the Rockets even though you might have gotten the better end of the McGrady-Francis deal. But like everyone else is saying, McGrady is one of the best players in the league so it would be very hard to get equal value for him. I like the trade for both teams and I think it will take a couple years to see who got the better end of the deal.

 

This trade alone didn't make or break both teams' seasons. The Magic made a horrible move by trading away Mobley who was playing very good for Christie who didn't fit in as well. That move also put Francis in a bad mood for the rest of the season. If Turkoglu also hadn't been out for a period of time, the Magic could have snuck into the playoffs.

Meanwhile, Houston at first had a 6-11 record. It wasn't until the team traded for David Wesley, Jon Barry and Bob Sura returned from his injury that the team turned their fortunes around. One team put a better cast around McGrady and Yao and the other put a bad one around Francis. The result shouldn't stun anyone.

Also, Rockfan06, I would advise you to cool it and be more mature. Don't take things so serious; some guys don't know much and would like to know, so don't diss them off. You're representing the Rockets forum here.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Trip:</div><div class="quote_post">This trade alone didn't make or break both teams' seasons. The Magic made a horrible move by trading away Mobley who was playing very good for Christie who didn't fit in as well. That move also put Francis in a bad mood for the rest of the season. If Turkoglu also hadn't been out for a period of time, the Magic could have snuck into the playoffs.

Meanwhile, Houston at first had a 6-11 record. It wasn't until the team traded for David Wesley, Jon Barry and Bob Sura returned from his injury that the team turned their fortunes around. One team put a better cast around McGrady and Yao and the other put a bad one around Francis. The result shouldn't stun anyone.

Also, Rockfan06, I would advise you to cool it and be more mature. Don't take things so serious; some guys don't know much and would like to know, so don't diss them off. You're representing the Rockets forum here.</div>
Well if you read my comments you would see that I explained why I said what I said. You're GM, and you're PG were dissing the Rockets Organization all year. I remember when the season was very young, everybody was saying the Rockets were over, and how Tmac was such a bad guy. I just wanted to let everybody know that I remembered that, and really didn't appreciate the hate. Other than that, I wish Orlando the best.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Rockfan06:</div><div class="quote_post">Well if you read my comments you would see that I explained why I said what I said. You're GM, and you're PG were dissing the Rockets Organization all year. I remember when the season was very young, everybody was saying the Rockets were over, and how Tmac was such a bad guy. I just wanted to let everybody know that I remembered that, and really didn't appreciate the hate. Other than that, I wish Orlando the best.</div>
Man, stop talking to me like I'm a Magic poster. Dude, I'm the Rockets team leader lol.

I know how you feel but there's more ways to do this than insult the Magic fans. Besides, TMac has already proved the haters wrong; there's probably no need for you to do that too.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Rockfan06:</div><div class="quote_post">First off, you DIDN'T GET THE BETTER OF THE TRADE. Look at it this way, TMac and Yao have one of the brightest futures in the NBA. Juwan Howard was playing the best ball of his career. Both LUV IT in Houston playing for Van Gundy. Tmac and Van Gundy NEVER clashed during the season or the playoffs. As far as Orlando, you made a great draft choice in Howard. But Steve Francis is a problem. First off he's one of the most turnover prone PG'S in the game. He dribbles WAY too much. Third, he's a bad teamate as far as practice and whinning about not getting help. Not to mention, he might get traded this season. All the while, TMac is going to end his career in Houston. So while Orlando has a good nucleus of young talent. I would think as far the Houston/ Orlando trade. You got HOODWINKED!!</div>
First of all, the Magic are not my team. And whether or not the Rockets prospered or not doesn't mean it was a bad trade for the Magic. McGrady and Yao might very well have the brightest futures in the NBA, but bright futures don?t necessarily equate to wins because if I?m not mistaken, the Rockets started off the season awfully. It wasn?t until they made some trade moves when they got their acts together. And what are you talking about Juwan Howard having his best year of his career? Pretty much every year has been better for Howard than this year. Please explain yourself here. Dwyane Wade is also one of the most turnover prone point guards as well in fact, he?s #1 in turnovers per 48 minutes. Francis is still a good player and now that they put Nelson as the starting point guard to exploit Francis? scoring abilities, I think you?ll see much better results. While you can make the argument about Francis offcourt shenanigans, the same can be said about McGrady especially when he was with Orlando in his final year. He himself said something like ?I wasn?t trying my hardest and being on a losing team I had to do something exceptional which is why I lead the league in scoring.? And not getting help? You do realize McGrady was complaining constantly about his lack of a supporting cast in Orlando, right? Being a fan of the NBA, history should tell you that nothing is certain. I remember Magic fans saying the same thing about McGrady when he was prospering in Orlando. ?McGrady will never leave Orlando. It is his hometown and he loves it here? but sure enough, McGrady wanted to leave when the going got tough. How do you know a similar situation won?t happen in Houston? How did the Magic get hoodwinked when they got a prolific scorer in Francis and at the time a lights out shooter in Mobley and a tough defensive anchor in Cato? At the time, they were in playoff position, but as was mentioned earlier, the deal for Christie is what changed everything. Had the Magic kept the roster together, it is possible they could have gotten into the second round of the playoffs and as Dwight continued to develop and as the Magic got more chemistry playing together, who knows, a possible conference finals appearance could have been in store for the next year. The Magic were playing much better this year than they were last year despite having a terrible point guard in Steve Francis and a superstar in Tracy McGrady the previous year.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MrJ:</div><div class="quote_post">First of all, the Magic are not my team. And whether or not the Rockets prospered or not doesn't mean it was a bad trade for the Magic. McGrady and Yao might very well have the brightest futures in the NBA, but bright futures don?t necessarily equate to wins because if I?m not mistaken, the Rockets started off the season awfully. It wasn?t until they made some trade moves when they got their acts together. And what are you talking about Juwan Howard having his best year of his career? Pretty much every year has been better for Howard than this year. Please explain yourself here. Dwyane Wade is also one of the most turnover prone point guards as well in fact, he?s #1 in turnovers per 48 minutes. Francis is still a good player and now that they put Nelson as the starting point guard to exploit Francis? scoring abilities, I think you?ll see much better results. While you can make the argument about Francis offcourt shenanigans, the same can be said about McGrady especially when he was with Orlando in his final year. He himself said something like ?I wasn?t trying my hardest and being on a losing team I had to do something exceptional which is why I lead the league in scoring.? And not getting help? You do realize McGrady was complaining constantly about his lack of a supporting cast in Orlando, right? Being a fan of the NBA, history should tell you that nothing is certain. I remember Magic fans saying the same thing about McGrady when he was prospering in Orlando. ?McGrady will never leave Orlando. It is his hometown and he loves it here? but sure enough, McGrady wanted to leave when the going got tough. How do you know a similar situation won?t happen in Houston? How did the Magic get hoodwinked when they got a prolific scorer in Francis and at the time a lights out shooter in Mobley and a tough defensive anchor in Cato? At the time, they were in playoff position, but as was mentioned earlier, the deal for Christie is what changed everything. Had the Magic kept the roster together, it is possible they could have gotten into the second round of the playoffs and as Dwight continued to develop and as the Magic got more chemistry playing together, who knows, a possible conference finals appearance could have been in store for the next year. The Magic were playing much better this year than they were last year despite having a terrible point guard in Steve Francis and a superstar in Tracy McGrady the previous year.</div>
For the record, I never said it was BAD trade. I said that the Rockets got the better of the trade. I'm not insulting the Magic fans, this thread was dedicated to the Tmac haters. Everybody who hated on Tmac before he even had a chance to put on a Rockets jersey. Alot of people made the bold prediction that the Magic got the better of the trade early in the season, I just wanted to know what they think now. But don't be all emotional, Orlando does have a bright future, WITHOUT FRANCIS.

 

hmmm...i guess the eastern conf. playoff teams went down to who wanted it more...and certainly the magic didn't seem to want it that much...the nets,xsixers and even the cavs looked hungrier...and of course,there's weisbord...

 

We do have a bright future and Francis should be involved with that. If I was a Rockets fan(not hating iam just wearing your shoes) then yea the Rockets got the better Deal in Tmac,Howard,Barry. Tmac is a great basketball player, Howard still has some game that many player dont respect(They dont guard him much of the time), Barry a talented family background and a role player.
But..As a Magic fan then yes we got the better deal
We get Francis,Kato,Doug the only trade i regret was the Mobley for Doug. Kato a shot blocking force which we lack, Doug an experienced vet great passer/defender anoying hand gesture, And Stevio playes with Heart which is something IMO(dont hate this) That Tmac lacked when playing here. I like Stevio and watched all the Magic games this year beacuse of his play. Watching the first two games shows why we traded for him.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting FlaBoy:</div><div class="quote_post">We do have a bright future and Francis should be involved with that. If I was a Rockets fan(not hating iam just wearing your shoes) then yea the Rockets got the better Deal in Tmac,Howard,Barry. Tmac is a great basketball player, Howard still has some game that many player dont respect(They dont guard him much of the time), Barry a talented family background and a role player.
But..As a Magic fan then yes we got the better deal
We get Francis,Kato,Doug the only trade i regret was the Mobley for Doug. Kato a shot blocking force which we lack, Doug an experienced vet great passer/defender anoying hand gesture, And Stevio playes with Heart which is something IMO(dont hate this) That Tmac lacked when playing here. I like Stevio and watched all the Magic games this year beacuse of his play. Watching the first two games shows why we traded for him.</div>
Francis has talent. But his decision making is terrible, especially on a fast break and in the 4th quarter. Plus he dribbles down the shot clock almost every possession. That just isn't winning basketball. He can be fun to watch, but most of the time he's a headache. With that said, it's obvious the Rockets got the better of the trade. Yes, we got blown out in the playoffs, but we did find away to make it there in the toughest division in the league. Not only that, we managed to win 50+ games (more than last year). So I would beg to differ anybody who thinks the Magic got the better of the trade. The Magic had a good draft, and Grant Hill had a good year. But as far as the trade, we got the edge.