Its funny how we used to criticize Murphy for padding his stats, not getting tough rebounds, shooting a low FG%, not blocking enough shots, etc. This season he's been shooting 50% from the field, 49% from 3, also getting career highs in assists (2.6), blocks (0.7), and steals (1.1) while playing only 28.6 mpg; overall hes much more of a team player and yet we still complain that he isn't hogging those easy rebounds and scoring more even though we know when he does he shoots a low %. I like his game alot more this year where hes a guy who does a little bit of everything, hes not getting a double double but hes probably contributing more to helping the team win than he was before.
<div class="quote_poster">REREM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Perhaps at season's end it does make sense to deal Murphy-at least if we get value. Right now...Ike and Zarko are on the shelf. Biedrens and Ike have-at times-collected fouls fast. With Murphy's trade value not high now-and us short on size-or size with experiance....it's logical Nellie continues to work on making Murphy a keeper. If the results are not adequate,then chances are higher he is swapped. Short term,The 4 buy-outs,Zarko,McLeod all expire-which is enough $ to sign Pietrus for $7 mill or more,even leaving something towards keeping Barnes or roberson. By the end of NEXT year,ideally some big contract departs-my choice would be Dunleavy. That gets us $ toward Ellis + Biedrens. If one guy---Dun..Murph was out,it would not quite likely cover the $ of extending Monta and Andy-but it would get close enough. The W's are NOT gonna leak talent to keep below the lux-tax line...but I'd figure there's some limits. With Foyle + Baron expiring in a few years,the plan is probably to pay the tax a year or two-try to do a GOOD deal-if it's available,to shed some $-but not firesale the guys we tagged as lotto picks,starters,worth $8-10 mills,until we are pretty sure. I'd give Dun and a rd 1 for Joe Expire and a future rd 2. No problem.</div> Well you're right too that we need to get limited players' values up. The most productive of three players that probably would be moved, if (internet public opinion mattered) would be Foyle, Dunleavy, Murphy (in that order). Obviously, we'd find it tougher to get to the playoffs using just rookies, but we would no longer be kidding ourselves about going the distance with those three players and being able to re-sign at least two strong players from our young core. And for me, this is really about being able to re-sign these three: Biedrins/Ike Diogu/Monta Ellis. And possibly a 4th guy for cheap whoever that is. I heard 2007 draft is pretty strong, so Jrich could even be a possibility if we're looking to change the chemistry at SG. But I'd leave our only 20ppg inside/outside scorer at decent % alone. But anyway, I'm really hoping that our backcourt improves a little bit and gets bigger and so does our frontcourt.
<div class="quote_poster">Run BJM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Its funny how we used to criticize Murphy for padding his stats, not getting tough rebounds, shooting a low FG%, not blocking enough shots, etc. This season he's been shooting 50% from the field, 49% from 3, also getting career highs in assists (2.6), blocks (0.7), and steals (1.1) while playing only 28.6 mpg; overall hes much more of a team player and yet we still complain that he isn't hogging those easy rebounds and scoring more even though we know when he does he shoots a low %. I like his game alot more this year where hes a guy who does a little bit of everything, hes not getting a double double but hes probably contributing more to helping the team win than he was before.</div> Yeah, run, I pointed that out after looking at the stat sheet on how he's improved under Nelson compared to the years with Monty. But you know, I watch the games, and he's good as a role player to spread the floor a little and collect defensive rebounds, but like Alleyoop was saying he's too far away from the action to help us out in the paint. With Murphy, he's just something I believe that cannot deliver for the running or halfcourt game because his limitations affect the roles for the rest of our squad. When he's not really a defensive player, not a center, not a power forward, not an interior scoring presence, no really a perimeter defender or kickass post defender like Clif was, and he's no creative playmaker that can pass without plays, I just think the power forward position could use somebody more like a power forward than some unique role playing guy. I mean we could use somebody that could body up like Biedrins and hustle for loose rebounds, but is strong like a center. We could use a guy with a very huge range of scoring solutions and the ability to pass and alter shots. I mean, that's why I'm such a big fan of a prototype power forward like Diogu was. He was his team's star player and he got tons of stats all while showing intangibles. I guess that's why I'm in a hurry to move Murphy out even though Ike Diogu is still injured, out of game shape, and still yet to be seen as a pro. But I like his potential a lot more than Murphy's for the power forward position. Murphy at C, I believe, just can't hang. I don't think he's even as good as Raef La Frentz was in his early Dallas days or the kind of rebounder Danny Fortson could be. But heck, what do I know. I got my favorites like gms and coaches do. Just like fans have their favorites.
Murphy's iincrease in blocks and steals is due purely to the zone. The perimiter guys force the action into the paint, where Murphy and Beans can camp and wait to block a shot. That's all that is. One-on-one, Murphy ain't blocking nobody. Please. No, I don't mean to be a pessimist here. I am a huge fan of loyalty and continuity -- I want to see the same guys stick around, and I value Murphy for all the hard work he's put in for GS over the years, even when things were in the tank. But honestly, at the big man positions, I want a big man. I don't care if you can shoot the three -- wtf are you even doing out there anyways? And don't give me the Nowitzki argument -- he's a rare breed, and while it's an added bonus if your PF can hit the three, it's not your stock recipe for success. At the PF position, I want toughness, rebounding, shot blocking, and good hands to finish. Do you see how I left out ball handling, outside shooting, passing, court vision, and movement without the ball? The reason is that those are the necessary traits for a SG, not a power position player. While it's an added bonus if you have them, they aren't crucial: the pre-requisites I mentioned first are, IMO. As much as I appreciate Murph's hard-nosed "tough-mindedness," the dude is not a tough player. He just doesn't bang inside. He is slow, unathletic, has a 2 inch vert, has wobbly knees, often looks off balance, and isn't all that muscular. While he's added some bulk, he's not an intimidating inside presence at all. I'd take Dany Fortson right now. Even though he'd suck in the "Nellie-ball" run-n-gun, lol. The Warriors need some tough, physical presence inside. I've been harping on this since I got to JBBall. I want someone at the PF who'll lay some wood on someone. Someone who will have Baron's back in a "street fight" on the court, who will bang, fight for rebounds, contest shots, push his weight around, and generally make it an unpeasant stay for any visitors in the paint. I by no means want a dirty player; what I want is a classic power forward guy. Gimme Charles Barkley. Gimme Dennis Rodman. Gimme Moses Malone. That's just my personal taste. Someone's got to do the dirty work. Did you see how apathetic GS looked against the Spurs and Rockets? blah. The Warriors can try to run every possession if they want, but it won't help if they're always taking the ball out at the baseline and not getting offensive rebounds on the other end. GS needs some muscle inside. Not a PF who sits on the perimiter and can't post up an opposing SG. Oh, and btw, Nowitzki can own people inside too. And he can jump. I like Troy. Hell, I don't necessarily even want to trade him. I just want some classic inside play. And no, I won't list off 10 different things I want to see at the PF position, and no I won't talk about every single aspect of the game in one single post. It's simple: GS needs some toughness inside at the PF. Murph doesn't give that.
Maybe we can convince Sacrmento that Troy Murphy is slower Brad Miller in the making. Troy Murphy 6-11 PF from Notre Dame 14.0 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 1.4 apg in 34.0 minutes --------for--------- Shareef Abdur-Rahim 6-9 PF from California 12.3 ppg, 5.0 rpg, 2.1 apg in 27.2 minutes Vitaly Potapenko 6-10 C from Wright State 2.5 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 0.3 apg in 10.6 minutes Would anyone do this trade? I hate SAR's defense, but the rest of his game I think is pretty damn good... well used to be. Very fundamentally sound player. A Jim Barnett player. SAR's guaranteed money is one year shorter than Murphy's and cheaper per year too.
Wow, this actually works: Jason Richardson 6-6 SG from Michigan State 23.2 ppg, 5.8 rpg, 3.1 apg in 38.4 minutes Incoming --------for--------- Andrei Kirilenko 6-9 SF from Russia (Foreign) 15.3 ppg, 8.0 rpg, 4.3 apg in 37.8 minutes If it was fantasy ball I'd do it. My prediction is that if those guys in this year's mock draft stay in, we'll have plenty of small forwards to choose from. Let's just find something good for Pietrus and not jump on Barnes because he's putting up numbers while the whole team isn't playing any defense and shooting tons of threes.
I'd do the Troy for SAR trade, just because it's one year closer to signing our young players. I'd also do the JR for AK-47 trade. Damn that'd be sweet: Baron Monta Barnes AK-47 Beans edit: Although AK-47 has been in a big slump, I would fully expect him to regain his old form, unlike Murphy who may have over-achieved in some regards.
<div class="quote_poster">AlleyOop Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I'd do the Troy for SAR trade, just because it's one year closer to signing our young players. I'd also do the JR for AK-47 trade. Damn that'd be sweet: Baron Monta Barnes AK-47 Beans edit: Although AK-47 has been in a big slump, I would fully expect him to regain his old form, unlike Murphy who may have over-achieved in some regards.</div> I guess AK-47 can provide some low post presence, but against who? Personally, the AK47 for Jrich thing was a joke, but maybe it isn't if Nelly wants a fundamentally sound, athletic, defensive SF/PF. Hmmm... Apparently Murphy for Houston's Bonzi Wells, Bob Sura (back again), and Kirk Snyder seems to work as well. More swingmen... yay!
<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Maybe we can convince Sacrmento that Troy Murphy is slower Brad Miller in the making. Troy Murphy 6-11 PF from Notre Dame 14.0 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 1.4 apg in 34.0 minutes --------for--------- Shareef Abdur-Rahim 6-9 PF from California 12.3 ppg, 5.0 rpg, 2.1 apg in 27.2 minutes Vitaly Potapenko 6-10 C from Wright State 2.5 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 0.3 apg in 10.6 minutes Would anyone do this trade? I hate SAR's defense, but the rest of his game I think is pretty damn good... well used to be. Very fundamentally sound player. A Jim Barnett player. SAR's guaranteed money is one year shorter than Murphy's and cheaper per year too.</div> ...not bad,mainly on the $ end. As these numbers show-however,Shareef ain't much of a rebounder,and "hate SAR's defense" does not hint at a gain there. As scorers-either could do better than they have. Murphy has become a much better passer,while SAR run a bit faster,so,it's hard to say,but close. That Murphy is for now our best option as backup C-or will be if he unpacks the jump shot he left somewhere.
<div class="quote_poster">REREM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">...not bad,mainly on the $ end. As these numbers show-however,Shareef ain't much of a rebounder,and "hate SAR's defense" does not hint at a gain there. As scorers-either could do better than they have. Murphy has become a much better passer,while SAR run a bit faster,so,it's hard to say,but close. That Murphy is for now our best option as backup C-or will be if he unpacks the jump shot he left somewhere.</div> thx, yeah it was mainly for $$$ reasons. Who knows, maybe Muss wants him? SAR has some cleverness and inside scoring skill that we could use. He used to be quite a good offensive player that could also pass it. He's like Jamison though on D.
Why not do a troy murph for Magliore straight up? It works. Not that portland would want him.... or his contract.... but murphy could work well with zach inside out.... and aside from his contract expiring i dont know how much mags can help us with the current style of play... but he would add toughness and size in the paint. He would certainly be a bigger asset come play off time .... if we ever get there.... when the game slows down.
I'd do Mags for Murphy trade. It would give us a good role playing center that was capable of being an Eastern Conference all-star at one point. It'd be like having 2003-04 Dampier back again (to some extent). Dampier was one of my faves in 2003-04 season until he got guaranteed money again
Don Nelson has said that he expected much more out of Murphy and that he hasn't seen it. Granted, there were the injuries, but I mean Pietrus has been having a career year wearing his mask, and the heel thing with Murph didn't surface till recently. So I wouldn't put all the blame on injuries as to why he's having a sub-par season. I think it has more to do with the fact that he's finally playing alongside legitimate rebounders in Beans and Barnes, and he's just not getting as many easy boards as before. Considering Murphy is basically a Dunleavy-type bench player, hell yeah I'd trade him for Magloire. The only thing stopping me is the fact that it appears some GMs actually have interest in Murph, and that -- as crazy as it sounds -- we might actually be able to get more for him.
I remember Nelson saying in preseason that Murph could average 20/10 if he played the way Nelson wanted him to
