<div class="quote_poster">Quoting AIRTIGHT:</div><div class="quote_post">Black Mamba _ on Kobe vs Jordan</div> What's your point? Why are you bringing that topic into here? It belongs in the Laker section and it was closed because it was going no where. I've already warned you once, keep it up and I'll warn you again. As for the topic and what I said. Like I stated, I like Wade a lot. But playing with Shaq makes it easier to get rebounds and assists. I saw it first hand with Kobe Bryant. Once Shaq left, he struggled in those departments. I'm not saying Wade will struggle, but his numbers in those departments will dip.
Bruin you said wade's jumper was inconsistent. 70% in the playoffs what did those top five players like kobe and bron shoot???
Black Mamba <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Shaq makes it easier to grab boards and get assists. He also draws attention and makes it easier to score. I'm not saying Wade is a bad player or that he would suck without Shaq, becuase I like Wade a lot. I'm just saying some of his numbers are because of the presence of Shaq</div>. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">What's your point? Why are you bringing that topic into here? It belongs in the Laker section and it was closed because it was going no where</div> The topic seems very applicable here as it deals with neither Kobe or Jordan, but Wade. --- well actually, I guess It could have something to do with Kobe as well right.. What exactly were you saying here? Why do you say the topic was going nowhere... with that statment coming from one of the top Kobe supporters, it actually seems like its getting kinda interesting to me. And how come Wades #'s are better than Kobe's we're--- yet <font color=""Sienna"">"Why Does Wade never get his props?"</font>
WOW seriously first it was Cav fans going crazy as to how Lebron was wrecking on the pistons. They got put in their place. Now its Miami Fans going crazy over Wade. I gaurantee that if Lebron was in Miami, they would have gone to the championship round last year and this year. And it is also true the if Wade was healthy, they would have done the same exact thing, but that doesnt change the fact that wade is at least 2 years older than Lebron is. It also doesnt change the fact that Wade still isn't above the 42 effieciency thing where they calculate all your stats into a formula and get a number. Lebron and Dirk are the only ones in this playoffs that have done it. Wade hasn't. AND wade does get his props, please don't say that he doesnt. He might be doing things that Lebron can't do but he has better players around him. Miami > cavs x 10 Wade came on a team with at least one player that could give him consistent points and minutes. He has exploited taht to every ability and is now reaping the benefits. Wade is probably the second most popular player in the NBA and would be #1 because his game is most fun to watch, but Lebron gets his hype from Nike.
Actually Wade is probably the most popular his jersey sales were ranked at number 1 I believe. People love his fearless style of play. Wade gets his props but not as much as Lebron does for not even making the ECF.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Best Kept Secret:</div><div class="quote_post">Billups didn?t say those exact words. Not trying to say Lebron is better than Wade. Both players are great at what they do for their respected organizations. Why can?t people just accept these two great young talents, embrace them, and watch them grow? Every time I see a thread on this forum giving one of those two players props, I see the other players fan base come in and say something along the lines of ?____ is still better?. People need to get over it both of them are great players leave it at that. As far as Wade not getting props for leading his team to the second round his rookie year. I agree to a certain extent, but not entirely. Wade did get his props sportscenter showed his game winning shot, the true NBA fans embraced him, and the Heat fans adored him. Now did he get as much props as Lebron would have if it was him in the situation? Probably not. Hey what are you going to do though? Not to get off topic, but does anyone feel like when the Heat got Shaq it sort of put a handicap on Wade? By handicap I mean an excuse for fans to say the only reason Wade is doing the things he is right now is due to Shaq.</div>Defanitally agree with your last point. But Billups did say something like "I think hes playing us better than Lebron" during one of those in game confrences(previously done). I'm not talking about him saying what he said about getting past lebron.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting bruin007:</div><div class="quote_post">Here are more than six players that are better than D Wade no way he cracks top five in any scenario: Tim Duncan, Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, Kevin Garnett, Elton Brand, Ray Allen, Jermaine O'neal, Dirk Nowitzki,Shawn Marion Id build my team around any of these guys... dont get me wrong Wade is a tough streaky two guard but he's not in the caliber of these guys imo...</div> Elton Brand, Ray Allen, Jermaine O'neal, and Shawn Marion are diffinately not the same level as wade.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TheBlackMamba:</div><div class="quote_post">What's your point? Why are you bringing that topic into here? It belongs in the Laker section and it was closed because it was going no where. I've already warned you once, keep it up and I'll warn you again.</div> Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the reason why it was closed is because AIRTIGHT pretty much sealed the deal with a great reply and it pissed of the laker fans to the point where there was no option but to close the thread.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting AIRTIGHT:</div><div class="quote_post">Black Mamba . The topic seems very applicable here as it deals with neither Kobe or Jordan, but Wade. --- well actually, I guess It could have something to do with Kobe as well right.. What exactly were you saying here? Why do you say the topic was going nowhere... with that statment coming from one of the top Kobe supporters, it actually seems like its getting kinda interesting to me. And how come Wades #'s are better than Kobe's we're--- yet <font color=""Sienna"">"Why Does Wade never get his props?"</font></div> I agree with you it is applicable imo. I don't see anything wrong with bringing another topic into the conversation if it is relevant to the point you are trying to make. As far as I understand BlackMamba is a moderator here on jbb right? You should facilitate dialogue and definately see that no one is breaking rules and what not but why do you feel the need to talk down to people? Iv'e noticed that in your responses to posts that have the smallest relevanance to something you say the need to chastise members. You've already done it to me for double posting... didnt know there was a rule against that... I can see how it can be annoying and distracting to a board but the way you go about making members aware of these rules is kind of rude and unnecessary. You warned him once and if he does it again you'll warn him again?...what's your point to that? No one is being offensive don't get defensive anything said on here should be taken with a grain of salt.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Lostmyluggage:</div><div class="quote_post">Elton Brand, Ray Allen, Jermaine O'neal, and Shawn Marion are diffinately not the same level as wade.</div> My point exactly they are at a much higher level in their respective careers imo. I don't thin Ray Allen is that great though but definately a franchise player. Wade as the centerpiece to Heat makes for a playoff drought in Miami... Wade fans will see this for themselves when shaq retires
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TmacGarnett:</div><div class="quote_post">WOW seriously first it was Cav fans going crazy as to how Lebron was wrecking on the pistons. They got put in their place. Now its Miami Fans going crazy over Wade. I gaurantee that if Lebron was in Miami, they would have gone to the championship round last year and this year. And it is also true the if Wade was healthy, they would have done the same exact thing, but that doesnt change the fact that wade is at least 2 years older than Lebron is. It also doesnt change the fact that Wade still isn't above the 42 effieciency thing where they calculate all your stats into a formula and get a number. Lebron and Dirk are the only ones in this playoffs that have done it. Wade hasn't. AND wade does get his props, please don't say that he doesnt. He might be doing things that Lebron can't do but he has better players around him. Miami > cavs x 10 Wade came on a team with at least one player that could give him consistent points and minutes. He has exploited taht to every ability and is now reaping the benefits. Wade is probably the second most popular player in the NBA and would be #1 because his game is most fun to watch, but Lebron gets his hype from Nike.</div> He wouldn't be the #1 most popular player that title would have gone to Kobe had he not had that Colorado scandal a couple years back... no argument that his momentum as the heir to jordan prior to Colorado was gaining steam and seemed an inevitability and we wouldnt be arguing over who the better player was.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Best Kept Secret:</div><div class="quote_post">Billups didn’t say those exact words. Not trying to say Lebron is better than Wade. Both players are great at what they do for their respected organizations. Why can’t people just accept these two great young talents, embrace them, and watch them grow? Every time I see a thread on this forum giving one of those two players props, I see the other players fan base come in and say something along the lines of “____ is still better”. People need to get over it both of them are great players leave it at that. As far as Wade not getting props for leading his team to the second round his rookie year. I agree to a certain extent, but not entirely. Wade did get his props sportscenter showed his game winning shot, the true NBA fans embraced him, and the Heat fans adored him. Now did he get as much props as Lebron would have if it was him in the situation? Probably not. Hey what are you going to do though? Not to get off topic, but does anyone feel like when the Heat got Shaq it sort of put a handicap on Wade? By handicap I mean an excuse for fans to say the only reason Wade is doing the things he is right now is due to Shaq.</div> I agree with every single word you said. Stop comaparing with Lebron and Wade and Kobe to Jordan. Lebron is Lebron, Wade is Wade, Kobe is Kobe, and Jordan is Jordan. No comparisons between these players. Ever. I actually see more Lebron haters then Wade haters. I don't hate Wade, or Lebron, they are both phenomenal players. But please don't think that Wade is suddenly becoming the Underdog here, not everybody has to like him just because he made it to the finals. Accept the facts. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">but Lebron gets his hype from Nike.</div> Yea, especially with his nickname "The King". It's a lot of pressure having that nickname on your shoulders, especially when your one of the youngest NBA players.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting bruin007:</div><div class="quote_post">My point exactly they are at a much higher level in their respective careers imo. I don't thin Ray Allen is that great though but definately a franchise player. Wade as the centerpiece to Heat makes for a playoff drought in Miami... Wade fans will see this for themselves when shaq retires</div> Are you handicapped? Even Shaq admits that Wade is the franchise as it is. If you're going to hate, at least have semi-plausible arguments like I do against Lebron...
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting virve119:</div><div class="quote_post">Are you handicapped? Even Shaq admits that Wade is the franchise as it is. If you're going to hate, at least have semi-plausible arguments like I do against Lebron...</div> I don't think I am but if I was then I wouldn't know the difference. Shaq "admitting " that Wade is the franchise is a veteran player giving confidence to his team's eager young talent to whom it would matter most to. Shaq could care less of being called the franchise he knows he is and so do you let's stop acting as if Wade is that team's face. Yes he is an integral part of that team No he's not better or ever will be better (accomplish the same amount of success shaq already has) than shaq. I'm giving you my opinion give me yours and we'll leave it at that no need to use the word "handicapp" to refer to a point of view you disagree with I'm sure people may find that offensive.
^^ Shaq cared a lot in LA who was the franchise player. Him admitting this is a much bigger deal than a player like dirk or kg admitting this
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Lostmyluggage:</div><div class="quote_post">Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that the reason why it was closed is because AIRTIGHT pretty much sealed the deal with a great reply and it pissed of the laker fans to the point where there was no option but to close the thread.</div> You're wrong. It was closed because everyone brought up great points. AIRTIGHT brought great arguments to the table and Laker fans brought great counter-arguments. The thread was getting repetitive and to be honest with you, annoying. From a moderator's view, the thread was about three posts away from being filled with JBB violations. There wasn't much more to add to the thread. Everything was covered. I didn't want it to blow up, so I closed it. That simple. His points were repetitive and so were Laker fans'. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Lostmyluggage:</div><div class="quote_post">Elton Brand, Ray Allen, Jermaine O'neal, and Shawn Marion are diffinately not the same level as wade.</div> This is a joke, right? Elton Brand is above Wade, IMO. Jermaine O'neal would be there with him too, if he couldd stay healthy. I agree that Allen and Marion aren't though. Elton Brand is a 6'8 PF. He's arguably the best PF in the league. He can hit shots from 5 feet away or from midrange. He's a monster on the glass, both offensive and defensive. He's a shot blocking machine and can take over a game from the start. Him and Wade are both top 10 players. If I had to build my team, it'd be around Brand...easily. Dominant bigs will win you championships now a days, not undersized 2 guards. Wade is great, don't get me wrong. But he still has a lot to learn before he's better than Brand. He needs to add defense and a perimeter game. Brand doesn't have to worry about the perimeter game, obviously. To be honest with you, it's hard to compare a big man with a guard, because they don't have the same roles on a team. But the common saying is, Never trade a big for a small.
Brand is getting rediculously overrated. I loved him this year and thought he was going to break out like he did. Best in the league at pf though, no way. TD, KG, and dirk are all clearly better than him with amare, JO (who i also think is overrated) and dwight and bosh are in a similar league as brand, who is better than these guys but not by much.
I think Brand, again this is my personal opinion, is miles ahead of Amare (what, so he can dunk the ball?), JO, Dwight (where's his offensive game?), and Bosh. I think you're underrating Brand. He's right up there with KG, arguably better than now. They put up similar numbers and honestly, bring the same impact to the game now a days. In the past, I'd easily go with KG, but he's getting old and is not a proven winner. Brand is turning into a winner. Dirk is better offensively, that's a given. But on defense, Dirk doesn't even compare to Brand. He doesn't snatch offensive boards like Brand, he doesn't block shots, change the pace of the game, or even alter shots like Brand does. I will give you Duncan though, he's pretty damn good. If I had to rank the PF's in the league today, it'd be: Duncan, Dirk, and then Brand, with KG right behind Brand.
How can you call a guy overrated who nearly averages 20 and 10 a game, brought respectability to the clippers name and was a major reason why the clippers made it past the first round of the playoffs since their days in Buffalo?
You do mean 25, 10, 2.5 blocks, right? I can understand not thinking Brand is up there with KG, Duncan, and Dirk because this was his first year of actually winning, but calling him overrated is taking it a bit far.
