Why is being able to shoot it suddenly a weakness?

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">So, Supersonic (because I believe you post more than any other Sonic fan), how about a sig bet? For an entire month...whoever gets farther in the playoffs...the other person will have to wear a sig of my choice/your choice for a month.

Injuries don't void the bet, either.</div>


And the point of that would be..?

I guess I'm just a little confused here because you turned a very simple thread about the Sonics into a full out bet regarding your Lakers.

The reason they are winning is because they are playing team basketball rather than depending on one spoiled superstar. Ray Allen has the sweetest shot in the league and he's playing great ball. Rashard has stepped up his game as well and has been putting up some great numbers. The point SS was trying to make was that team chemistry means more in the end than how much one great player can do. (I'd hate to bring up my team because I just find stuff like that irrevelent to the topic - but look at McGrady of last year. He was great, but Orlando didn't have a team. Everyone clashed and instead of trying to work together to win, they just looked awkward. In the end we all know what happened, and thats why I think it's more important to have several good players rather than a great one)

I agree with Iron Shiek that you guys are playing like a European team, but IMO you guys are playing like a college team as well. Everyone plays together with a positive attitude to never give up no matter who the opponent is.

The Sonics are by far the most surprising team this year. IMO more so than the Suns because they added Nash and everyone knew Amare would improve.

For the Sonics to snap the Spurs 21 home game win streak just goes to show that they are for real. People just don't want to believe it, which is a shame because they are fun to watch.

 

It's funny how you consider Kobe selfish, yet he's averaging more assists than anyone on the entire Sonics squad.

This isn't exactly about the Lakers, but I wasn't the one to drag them into this, either.

The thread was a rant that everyone is doubting the Sonics...everyone is saying this and that...oookay. My response, since I knew I'd be the only one to respond in a negative way, is that it's going to happen. Get over it. Nobody liked the Lakers when they were stomping every team in the league for three consecutive rings...but we didn't care because we had the rings.

If you are sick of being considered mediocre, yet with a good record...win in the playoffs. That's all that matters. Until you do, expect people to doubt you.

On a side note...some people set themselves up for this in the first place...not only by making the thread, but by mocking a team that has won championships galore. Check your sig...I've got plenty of quotes I could use for the Sonics...but I choose not to. It seems like you guys worry more about our team than your own, sometimes.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">

On a side note...some people set themselves up for this in the first place...not only by making the thread, but by mocking a team that has won championships galore. Check your sig...I've got plenty of quotes I could use for the Sonics...but I choose not to. It seems like you guys worry more about our team than your own, sometimes.</div>

Nobody is worried about the Lakers. The thing is that the Lakers are only relevant now when they are playing against winning teams that have players that will bash Kobe through the media (Sonics, Heat, and whatever team Karl Malone will sign w/).

The playoffs are four months away from now. The fact that people are talking about us proving ourselves in the playoffs shows me that the Sonics have made remarkable strides from last year. Also the fact that other posters are coming into this forum to hate on us shows us that we must be doing a lot of good things as well.

The best advice that I have for your team struggles would be to tell Rudy T. to study some of our game film and incorporate it into your system. Kobe hasn't won anything on his own since high school.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">Nobody is worried about the Lakers. The thing is that the Lakers are only relevant now when they are playing against winning teams that have players that will bash Kobe through the media (Sonics, Heat, and whatever team Karl Malone will sign w/).</div>
The Lakers have nearly beaten the Heat (the best team in the East), the Suns (better than the Sonics), the Spurs, and they destroyed the Kings at ARCO. But no...nobody is worried about us.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">The playoffs are four months away from now. The fact that people are talking about us proving ourselves in the playoffs shows me that the Sonics have made remarkable strides from last year. Also the fact that other posters are coming into this forum to hate on us shows us that we must be doing a lot of good things as well.</div>
The Sonics HAVE made remarkable strides from last year. I'm not saying you haven't. The point is, there was no reason to rant about what people are saying, because it happens. Seattle is 22-6 or whatever...so be it. There are 54 more games to be played as well. Maybe it's because the Sonics are actually winning for the first time since the Kemp/Payton era...that's why everyone is shocked. Congrats.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">The best advice that I have for your team struggles would be to tell Rudy T. to study some of our game film so that yall can turn things around in SoCal. Kobe hasn't won anything on his own since high school.</div>
Yeah, I'll give that advice to a team with only one returning starter, a new coach, a new offense, new assistant coaches, and a slew of young kids...and who were ripped off by grabbing Vlade Divac.

You guys must be proud of yourself...owning a better record than a depleted team like the Lakers. A terrible, terrible team like the Lakers...who are just over .500 in the West. So go jump for joy in Seattle...jump as much as you can, because within the next year, the Sonics will be, once again, looking up to Los Angeles, like they've done since...well...forever.

One more thing. Name me one single player in the NBA that has won a conference championship or a ring by himself. You do that, and if you can get everyone to agree, then I'll leave JBB. Put your money where your mouth is, Shiek.

 

Will someone please put together a poll that asks the question of whether or not the 1994 Rockets were essentially a one man team. Outside of Hakeem Olajuwon, everyone on that roster was a straight roll player (Clyde Drexler came in the following year). Rudy T. was partly hired b/c he has a history of riding one player.

Is there a cut off percentage that you are looking for, Real Deal?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">

One more thing. Name me one single player in the NBA that has won a conference championship or a ring by himself. You do that, and if you can get everyone to agree, then I'll leave JBB. Put your money where your mouth is, Shiek.</div>


Will someone please put together a poll that asks the question of whether or not the 1993-1994 Rockets were essentially a one man team. Outside of Hakeem Olajuwon, everyone on that roster was a straight role player (Clyde Drexler came in the following year). Rudy T. was partly hired b/c he has a history of riding one player.

Is there a cut off percentage that you are looking for, Real Deal? Your rent isn't due soon, is it?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">Will someone please put together a poll that asks the question of whether or not the 1993-1994 Rockets were essentially a one man team. Outside of Hakeem Olajuwon, everyone on that roster was a straight roll player (Clyde Drexler came in the following year). Rudy T. was partly hired b/c he has a history of riding one player.

Is there a cut off percentage that you are looking for, Real Deal?</div>
So you're going to cut the rope on Kenny Smith, Mario Elie, Sam Cassell, and Robert Horry? Wow.

Actually...1993...Otis Thorpe and Vernon Maxwell were awesome as well. Thorpe was a 56% shooter and scored 14 PPG...it was a balanced attack from the perimeter and from Hakeem in the paint...don't give me that BS about Hakeem doing everything.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">It's funny how you consider Kobe selfish, yet he's averaging more assists than anyone on the entire Sonics squad.
</div>
I didn't consider Kobe selfish.

I think you are missing the entire point of all of this. The Supersonics are doing good because they don't need someone to 'average more assists.' It seems like it's all about stats when it comes to you and Kobe. Seattle doesn't need anyone averaging more assists because they ALL share the ball and distribute it evenly. I'll pull out some stats for you - Ridnour is leading them in assists with 6.2. Then Daniels and Allen follow him with about 4 per game. Kobe on the other hand is averaging 7.1 with Atkins following him with 3.8 and Odom with about 2.

Because the Supersonics display teamwork, they don't need someone to average more assists. They can all share the ball and help eachother 'get theirs.'

They are a very balanced team, and that is why they are doing good. One superstar doesn't equal success but several key guys does.

Think about the Pistons during the finals. They won because they displayed great teamwork and played together. (Plus their amazing defense).

You cannot be dependent on one player and in todays NBA that has shown.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">So you're going to cut the rope on Kenny Smith, Mario Elie, Sam Cassell, and Robert Horry? Wow.

Actually...1993...Otis Thorpe and Vernon Maxwell were awesome as well. Thorpe was a 56% shooter and scored 14 PPG...it was a balanced attack from the perimeter and from Hakeem in the paint...don't give me that BS about Hakeem doing everything.</div>

I don't know any team in any team sport that doesn't get some contributions from other role players, but if you are trying to tell me that Kenny Smith, a player who was traded at least six times, Mario Elie, the definition of NBA journeyman, Sam Cassell and Robert Horry in their NBA diapers, aging Otis Thorpe, and crazy ass Mad Max were a big time supporting cast then you are just a stubborn SOB. They got credit only b/c they won and they won b/c Olajuwon played like a combination of Chamberlain, Russell, and Jordan in the playoffs. That team wasn't even predicted to go to the Western Conference Finals.

Put together a poll in the NBA and Rockets forum and see what you get.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Ice:</div><div class="quote_post">I didn't consider Kobe selfish.

I think you are missing the entire point of all of this. The Supersonics are doing good because they don't need someone to 'average more assists.' It seems like it's all about stats when it comes to you and Kobe. Seattle doesn't need anyone averaging more assists because they ALL share the ball and distribute it evenly. I'll pull out some stats for you - Ridnour is leading them in assists with 6.2. Then Daniels and Allen follow him with about 4 per game. Kobe on the other hand is averaging 7.1 with Atkins following him with 3.8 and Odom with about 2.

Because the Supersonics display teamwork, they don't need someone to average more assists. They can all share the ball and help eachother 'get theirs.'</div>
Ah, exactly. But where did I even mention anything about the Sonics needing to average bigger numbers individually?

When I said Kobe averages more assists than anyone on the Sonics, that was the end of it. The reason I said it? He's always the selfish player...he's always doing things by himself...yada yada. This topic was NOT about the Lakers in the first place until someone else had to drag them through the mud.

Sure, the Sonics are working as a team. That's my point...why criticize the Lakers then? The Lakers are pretty damn good for being together for approx. 30 games. I remember people saying we would win 30 games or less...ha. Where are those people at now (and by the way, I'm talking BSPN and FOX Sports as well as members here at JBB).

By the way...Kobe with 7 a game, Atkins with 4, and Odom with 3 APG...and Tierre with 2 APG...big difference compared to the Sonics: Ridnour with 6, Allen and Daniels with 4 a piece...everyone else at one assist or below. Another stat? The Lakers are averaging more assists per game as a team than the Sonics are.

How?

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">That team wasn't even predicted to go to the Western Conference Finals.</div>
That's true. Actually, your Sonics were, huh? With their 63-19 record.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">
By the way...Kobe with 7 a game, Atkins with 4, and Odom with 3 APG...and Tierre with 2 APG...big difference compared to the Sonics: Ridnour with 6, Allen and Daniels with 4 a piece...everyone else at one assist or below. Another stat? The Lakers are averaging more assists per game as a team than the Sonics are.

How? </div>

B/c most likely we shoot more threes, get more offensive rebounds and put backs, and we get to the free throw line more than the Lakers. All ways to score w/o racking up assists totals.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">B/c we shoot more threes, get more offensive rebounds and put backs, and we get to the free throw line more than the Lakers. All ways to score w/o racking up assists totals.</div>
Hmm...

The Lakers have shot 603 3PA's. The Sonics? 607. (big difference)

The Lakers have 336 total offensive rebounds. The Sonics? 329.

The Lakers have 757 total free throw attempts. The Sonics? 740.

Do your homework. This was too easy.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">B/c we shoot more threes, get more offensive rebounds and put backs, and we get to the free throw line more than the Lakers. All ways to score w/o racking up assists totals.</div>
Thank you.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Ah, exactly. But where did I even mention anything about the Sonics needing to average bigger numbers individually?</div>
You didn't, but saying Kobe averaged more assists than anyone on the entire Sonics squad is a slap in the face to their success. You were downgrading everything they have done this season while putting Kobe on a golden plate. Individually they are balanced, unlike the Lakers. They depend on Kobe because if he has an off game, they will lose.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">
That's true. Actually, your Sonics were, huh? With their 63-19 record.</div>

It's amazing how the subject changes when someone calls another's bluff.

1993-1994 Houston Rockets poll please. Were the NBA Champion Houston Rockets of 1993-1994 (pre-Drexler) primarily a one-man team?

Again, what is the cut off percentage?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Ice:</div><div class="quote_post">Thank you.</div>
The Lakers have shot 603 3PA's. The Sonics? 607. (big difference)

The Lakers have 336 total offensive rebounds. The Sonics? 329.

The Lakers have 757 total free throw attempts. The Sonics? 740.

You're welcome.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">Hmm...

The Lakers have shot 603 3PA's. The Sonics? 607. (big difference) </div>
The big difference is the number that goes in - which is what counts the most. The Sonics are shooting just under 40% with Lewis, Radmanovic, and Ridnour shooting at 40% or above.

Oh yeah.. as for LA - Tierre Brown is the only player shooting above 40% from 3 point range and he averages 13 minutes per game. Talk about an All Star.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">It's amazing how the subject changes when someone calls another's bluff.

1993-1994 Houston Rockets poll please. Were the NBA Champion Houston Rockets of 1993-1994 (pre-Drexler) primarily a one-man team?

Again, what is the cut off percentage?</div>
Okay, let's all do a poll that will obviously be in favor of a Sonic's fan vs. a Laker fan who everyone despises. Yeah, good idea.

Stop avoiding the entire subject. You misdirected this topic by trying to prove that there's a player who can do it all by himself...when the fact is, it has absolutely NOTHING to do with the Sonics, because there's not a player on there that's even close to being a great player.

Make your "poll" for everyone to vote on. Fine by me...it has no relevance to this issue in the first place. The Rockets won two straight rings with those players...if Hakeem was the only one out on the court, I must have been blind. Who guarded Penny Hardaway against Orlando, when Shaq was completely dominated by Hakeem? Give it up.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Real Deal:</div><div class="quote_post">Hmm...

The Lakers have shot 603 3PA's. The Sonics? 607. (big difference)

The Lakers have 336 total offensive rebounds. The Sonics? 329.

The Lakers have 757 total free throw attempts. The Sonics? 740.

Do your homework. This was too easy. </div>

Check the percentages, fam not the totals. We can only rebound the shots we miss. We only count the free throws that go in. And something tells me that those totals are skewed by the fact that the Lakers have played in more games than the Sonics.

Calm down, Real Deal. There are actually knowledgeable fans in this forum.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Ice:</div><div class="quote_post">The big difference is the number that goes in - which is what counts the most. The Sonics are shooting just under 40% with Lewis, Radmanovic, and Ridnour shooting at 40% or above.

Oh yeah.. as for LA - Tierre Brown is the only player shooting above 40% from 3 point range and he averages 13 minutes per game. Talk about an All Star. </div>


Sonics 3PT% - .381

Lakers 3PT% - .363

Oh, and Chucky Atkins - .401 (not just Tierre)

Lewis, Radmanovic and Ridnour All-Stars? Possibly Lewis, who is the man in Seattle.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">those totals are skewed by the fact that the Lakers have played in more games than the Sonics.

Calm down, Real Deal. There are actually knowledgeable fans in this forum.</div>
Lakers have played 27 games...Sonics 28.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">those totals are skewed by the fact that the Lakers have played in more games than the Sonics.

Calm down, Real Deal. There are actually knowledgeable fans in this forum.</div>
Lakers have played 27 games...Sonics 28.