Scoot and Sharpe in the backcourt?

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by Bingo Bango, Jun 5, 2023.

  1. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    32,669
    Likes Received:
    41,149
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Zero chance (IMO) that Portland offers the 3 for either of those guys.
     
    TBpup likes this.
  2. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    21,539
    Likes Received:
    33,533
    Trophy Points:
    113
    they may be telling the truth....even though truth almost never comes out of any NBA front office in the period of time between the lottery and the draft

    it's simple negotiation 101 to say you won't trade the asset you're actually willing to trade
     
    GoBlazersGo and Phatguysrule like this.
  3. Ripcity4life77

    Ripcity4life77 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2016
    Messages:
    1,415
    Likes Received:
    1,320
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I believe the Nets they legit want to keep Bridges and I think Bridges likes it there but the thing with Brown is he is not a fan of Boston area and kind of wants out so matter of him playing hardball just not sure he will since he can make a shit ton of money. Now I have heard money is not a deciding factor for him but let's be real it will play some factor and with the Blazer having a owner ( caretaker at best ) at the moment not sure she wants to pony out the money for Grant and Brown or insert another star name here so might be a mute point.
     
  4. blazerkor

    blazerkor Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2014
    Messages:
    14,428
    Likes Received:
    15,363
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The thing about Brown is that he'd have to ditch a supermax for a max contract it's a pretty significant loss. Maybe he's the type of guy to do that on principal but I don't know how wise that would be. If he gets traded he doesn't get the supermax if he takes the supermax he can't be traded for one year after signing the extension.
     
    BIG Q likes this.
  5. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    21,539
    Likes Received:
    33,533
    Trophy Points:
    113
    ftfy
     
    Natebishop3 likes this.
  6. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    91,216
    Likes Received:
    53,502
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Adam Silver: "With the 10th pick in the 2023 NBA draft, the Portland Trail Blazers select..... Zach Col..... wait what?"
     
    lamlor likes this.
  7. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    Messages:
    42,754
    Likes Received:
    24,405
    Trophy Points:
    113
    As you know, I think they trade regardless. IF Scoot is there at 3 they should take him and trade Dame
     
    Natebishop3 and lamlor like this.
  8. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,638
    Likes Received:
    13,637
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    Who can give them something they want really?

    Maybe Miami or Brooklyn for future picks. Otherwise, just don't see who can give them anything good.

    I just don't see Dame being traded if Scoot is drafted. If anything, it just makes it certain they really try to move Ant. That's about it.
     
    Pinwheel1 likes this.
  9. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    91,216
    Likes Received:
    53,502
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    I'd have to go back but I think Dame said there were more than just those two teams.
     
  10. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,638
    Likes Received:
    13,637
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    I am trying to find teams that have contracts and picks that might work, these are the only ones that kind of seem like they have it and maybe have some sort of stuff that might be attractive for Dame.

    Miami wil have to be Lowery, Duncan and picks, Brooklyn would be around Simmons and the phx picks
     
  11. STOMP

    STOMP mere fan

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    10,729
    Likes Received:
    3,129
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Marin
    well yeah, but I posted what I think will happen not what I'd do. If I was the GM, I'd accept reality and embrace the next era instead of blowing smoke up the fanbase's butt that the team is anywhere close to contending.

    I expect them to try to split the baby... and that always works out so well

    STOMP
     
  12. SheedSoNasty

    SheedSoNasty Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2008
    Messages:
    4,324
    Likes Received:
    4,755
    Trophy Points:
    113
    What about Herro?
     
    Whyachi likes this.
  13. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,638
    Likes Received:
    13,637
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    The assumption is that if the blazers move dame it's to build with scoot and shae in the back court, they don't need herro in this case. They also have ant yet, so why herro?
     
  14. SheedSoNasty

    SheedSoNasty Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2008
    Messages:
    4,324
    Likes Received:
    4,755
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Because he’s probably the best value that Miami could provide while keeping Butler and Adebayo.
     
  15. Pinwheel1

    Pinwheel1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    21,725
    Likes Received:
    14,187
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yep, this is the type of shit return for Dame that I am expecting..... an overpaid player who is good, but whose skills can be found without trading your leader for.
     
    HailBlazers and wizenheimer like this.
  16. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,638
    Likes Received:
    13,637
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    Nah, for Portland, the best value is the picks. They are looking into the future when Shae and Scoot are more seasoned, not for someone else that will take time from their on-court development. Herro will require additional moves to find him a home as there is no need for him on the roster of a rebuilding team that has Shae, Scoot and maybe even Ant. Robinson does not take time from them. Lowry can be a backup PG and veteran presence. Herro directly compete with them for play time. That's why he is not the guy in this scenario.
     
  17. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    21,539
    Likes Received:
    33,533
    Trophy Points:
    113
    so, it's Lowry + Robinson + picks....am I reading this right?

    Dame can't be traded till July 10 and definitely won't ask to be traded until he sees a chunk of the off-season, after the draft. So the 2023 Miami pick is pretty much not part of this idea. In fact, it wouldn't be part of it. That leaves Miami first's from 2024 and beyond

    well, Miami has traded away their 2025-->2026 first(s). So they can't trade their 2024 first because of the Septien rule. Meaning the earliest unencumbered first round pick they have is 2028.

    so the best trade from Miami would be Lowry + Robinson + 2028 unprotected + 2029 pick swap + 2030 unprotected. Two first's and a swap 5-7 years from now. And this is assuming that Pat Riley is dumb enough to trade unprotected 1st's that far out, which he probably isn't

    am I missing something? this is supposed to be a 'good' Dame trade?
     
    Pinwheel1 likes this.
  18. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,638
    Likes Received:
    13,637
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    The assumption was that the 2023 pick is part of it and Portland likes it, and as far as I know they already traded the 2025 pick to OKC if it falls in the 15+ range, and 2026 if it does not convey, so it is actually 2027 the first they can trade because the 2025/2026 is basically the same pick they traded, if I understand it correctly.

    If this is enough or not, that's up to Portland, but it sure seems like a reasonable start. Maybe Portland also requires more and it's up to Miami to figure out how to flip Herro for additional picks, but I just don't see why Portland would want Herro in this scenario.

    I am not saying that's a great trade for Portland, but it is hard to do one that is good for both Dame and Portland. That's probably one of the options that kind of helps both.
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2023
  19. Pinwheel1

    Pinwheel1 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2008
    Messages:
    21,725
    Likes Received:
    14,187
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yeah, this is a good example of why I am ok with trading Dame if he wants to go, but not excited about it either.
    Hell, we can all barely agree on who at #3 player will help us be a contender in the future.....let alone future draft picks that
    might not even be in the lottery if Dame goes to a good team.
     
  20. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    21,539
    Likes Received:
    33,533
    Trophy Points:
    113
    "assumption" is a tricky tool

    my assumption is that Dame isn't going ask out until, at the earliest, he sees how the off-season unfolds. Which would be toward the end of July. And the Blazers won't be discussing any trades for Dame until he asks out. So I just don't give any credibility, at all, to trade ideas for Dame that include the 2023 draft. Completely unrealistic

    as for the Stepian rule, the pertinent part is this:

    Teams are restricted from trading away future first round draft picks in consecutive years. This is known as the "Ted Stepien Rule." Stepien owned the Cavs from 1980-83, and made a series of bad trades (such as the 1980 trade mentioned above) that cost the Cavs several years' first round picks. As a result of Stepien's ineptitude, teams are now prevented from making trades which might leave them without a first round pick in consecutive future years.

    When dealing with protected picks, the Stepien rule is interpreted to mean that a team can't trade a pick if there is any chance at all that it will leave the team without a first round pick in consecutive future drafts.

    http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q89

    and the encumbrance Miami has is:

    upload_2023-6-7_10-17-58.png

    so then, in mid-late July, and beyond, if Portland is discussing a Dame trade with Miami, the Heat's 2025 and 2026 first's are out of the conversation. OKC owns them both even though they will only get one or the other

    and that means Miami can't trade their 2024 first. And since OKC might get Miami's 2026 first, the heat can't trade their 2027 first. So the only open Miami picks would be the three first's from 2028-2030. Meaning the best Portland can do, pick-wise from Miami is two first's and a swap 5-7 years from now (this might be where somebody tries to argue Miami can trade their 2027 first contingent on yadayada, but that's meaningless)

    and I really don't believe Pat Riley would trade unprotected 1st's that far out
     

Share This Page