NFL free agency and draft thread

And this debate on the tackles, which one/who projects best/G or T, is exactly why standing pat and taking one at # 4 is crazy.... There is no consensus here. And we need a tackle not a guard, so we need to be sure whomever we take, if we take an OL, can be a very very good tackle at the very least. If he isn't then it is a fail at # 4. And if one of the other 3 turns out to be much better, that is also a fail at # 4. To me there is way more risk than reward taking one of these guys at 4.

Worst case, get a 3rd and a 5th and trade down between 5-10. Then take your tackle.

Jones and Mahomes both read coverages at a high level their first year of play. Mahomes also sat on the bench for his first year. Mahomes has the stronger arm but he is not nearly as accurate as Jones is. Both are mobile. Both take unnecessary hits. They are alike in many ways. Jones is plenty creative. You just can't see it all the time because his OL sucks ass while Mahomes has a very solid OL and his offensive weapons stay healthy.

My hope is that Detroit doesn't trade their pick, if they do the Giants trade back with Miami one spot and pick up the 5th and their second. Take Wirfs or Wills. Then go DE and C with their second round picks.

Lord we need this draft and some sports to happen.

13 days until the draft..sports? well, that's a different story.

People need to get a clue that the Giants are not drafting a safety with their second round pick. Love will be the FS. Now if they trade back once or twice and pick up a couple more second rounders, then maybe. I think they try to pick up Miami's second rounder and move back one spot then draft either a DE or C and a WR with their second rounders. WR is a priority. Sheppard has concussion issues and Tate is old. I still hope they can get a second rounder for Engram.

McShay is a moron. He said that he thinks Darnold has the most talent of any QB in the last 3 years. IMO, he couldn't lift Daniel Jones jock strap. Darnold going back to college has been way below average with reading coverages and with his decision making. I can't remember in quite some time a QB that the media has tried to make out to be great who does pretty much nothing but play average. He consistently his entire career college and pro career makes idiotic decisions that lead to INT's. I'll be laughing when the Giants improve their OL, Barkley rushes for 1,600 yards each year and Jones consistently throws 30+ TD's with 10-12 INT's while Darnold is throwing 20 INT's every season.

Two days away! Reports that the Giants are looking closely at Herbert while may be true, is a sign to me that they are looking for a trade partner more so than considering drafting him, there is just no way the Giants would take Herbert and everyone knows it.

Looks like it will be Wirfs or Wills, which obviously fills a big need, and that is okay from my POV. I wish/hope we can trade back a few spots and still get one of the OL, but if not so be it. I just hope the OL they select turns out to be a great Pro-Bowl player, and after playing their rookie year at RT can move to LT and replace Solder. If they cannot do that, or one of the other OL turns out to be much better, that is not good picking 4th, but again it fills a big need, and hopefully Gettleman selects the best one of the four.

The real question is this. San Fran has two first rounders then nothing to the 5th. They are trying to trade back and pick up a second. They want Engram. If they can move back from 13, pick up a good second and still have their highest first at around 20, I could see them sending that second rounder for Engram. If the Giants had 2 second rounders, they might take Simmons then go tackle and second in the second round. Becton is going to drop like a rock now with his failed drug test. Teams simply don't want guys like that.

Andrew Thomas...WOW. We all knew they were taking an OT but few people expected it to be Thomas I think. This pick is a perfect argument for trading down.

Terrible. The guy was consistently rated 4th of the 4 OT's, and we take him at # 4. Please fire Gettleman. I mean give me a break. Everywhere you look he was rated 4th of the 4, and most times was mocked to the Bucs at 14. I am sure the kid will be solid, but we could have traded down 8 spots and still gotten him. And Wirfs and Wills were both rated higher, as was Becton. Only thing I can say is he may be the most ready to play LT after next season when Solder goes.

Thomas better be a f'ing stud and be able to play LT, or Gettleman is done. If Wirfs/Wills are better it will show the ineptness of the Gettleman.

And BTW, and I am 100% convinced this guy has ZERO concept of value. He says I like this guy and drafts him.

Takes a RB at # 2.
Takes Jones at # 6, when he could have taken him much later.
Takes the 4th rated OT at number 4. Could have traded down 8-10 spots and gotten him, or one of the other tackles.

Gettleman is lost. It is very sad. 69 and it shows. Stuck in the stone age.

Every single pick 1-7 has been as predicted. Sure the Giants took a different OT, but everyone knew they were taking an OT. Not one surprise in the top 7 from virtually every mock. Boring, but I guess given the circumstances that was also predictable.

So funny. Giants take the consensus 4th rated OT at # 4. No other OL is taken in the first 9 picks (VALUE). The Jets get an OL who pretty much everyone rated higher than Thomas at # 11. And through 12 picks Wirfs still available (he will most likely go 13 to TB). And we took the 4th rated OT at # 4.

Look, I am sure Thomas will be a solid player, the guy has SEC top level pedigree. He also is more ready to be a LT than the other 3 guys I think. But taking him at 4 made no sense at all. It is just illogical and again shows how lost Gettleman is.

RangersFan said:

So funny. Giants take the consensus 4th rated OT at # 4. No other OL is taken in the first 9 picks (VALUE). The Jets get an OL who pretty much everyone rated higher than Thomas at # 11. And through 12 picks Wirfs still available (he will most likely go 13 to TB). And we took the 4th rated OT at # 4.

Look, I am sure Thomas will be a solid player, the guy has SEC top level pedigree. He also is more ready to be a LT than the other 3 guys I think. But taking him at 4 made no sense at all. It is just illogical and again shows how lost Gettleman is.

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Stick to hockey. He was the number 1 rated OT all season long. The draft "experts" fell in love with these other guys during the combine. He is the most NFL ready OT in the draft and a LT

I don't care where he was rated all year long. 1. He was not the top rated T now. He was the 4th rated T. And yes I know I'll get the I don't care where people had him ranked. Again VALUE. 2. No other OL went in the top 9 picks, yet we felt the need to take the consensus 4th rated OL at # 4. That's terrible. The OL lasted until pick 13, which was just as predicted (13 or 14 would be the last of the 4 OL). Again VALUE.

I say all that while again saying I think Thomas will be a solid player. I don't think he'll be the best of the 4, based on upside I figure he'll be a very solid player and be the 3rd or 4th best OL out of this draft in 3 years. Very solid, but no way worth the # 4 pick, and at least 2 of the other top OL will be better long run I think.

I also love the Cowboys pick. I am a huge fan of Lamb. Huge add for them. If they don't win a lot of games next season they never will.

RangersFan said:

I don't care where he was rated all year long. 1. He was not the top rated T now. He was the 4th rated T. And yes I know I'll get the I don't care where people had him ranked. Again VALUE. 2. No other OL went in the top 9 picks, yet we felt the need to take the consensus 4th rated OL at # 4. That's terrible. The OL lasted until pick 13, which was just as predicted (13 or 14 would be the last of the 4 OL). Again VALUE.

I say all that while again saying I think Thomas will be a solid player. I don't think he'll be the best of the 4, based on upside I figure he'll be a very solid player and be the 3rd or 4th best OL out of this draft in 3 years. Very solid, but no way worth the # 4 pick, and at least 2 of the other top OL will be better long run I think.

I also love the Cowboys pick. I am a huge fan of Lamb. Huge add for them. If they don't win a lot of games next season they never will.

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CeeDee is steal of the draft so far. Friggin Cowturds got him

RangersFan said:

Thomas better be a f'ing stud and be able to play LT

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He has the most LT experience out of all 4, I think he is perfectly capable of playing LT. It was the other 3 whose LT ability was questionable.

Look, you can be as upset as you want about Thomas at 4, but it's just factually incorrect to say he was the consensus #4, he was consistently ranked 4, that everyone had Becton higher than him, and whatever other absolutes you just threw out there. MANY had him number 1, including 2 guys whose opinions I respect very much: David Diehl and Shaun Ohara. They said without question he's the most pro ready. If you need other examples I can send you several.

Im very happy with this pick. A true LT who played against the best competition for an immobile QB. Good player, good head on his shoulders, no red flags.

Hard to kill DG for not trading back given that there were hardly any trades at all. Teams obviously very hesitant to move around given this environment.

PFF had him #1 as well. Here's every snap against the guy who was the second edge rusher drafted after Chase Young.

This pick was all about protecting the #2 and #6 picks. After watching video of Thomas throwing edge rushers around like rag dolls I like the pick. I think most Giants fans felt like me and wanted this year's #1 to be used to improve the awful Oline, nitpicking about which one DG picked because Mel Kiper Jr disagrees is silly, all 4 were going in the first round. The criticism of DG is unfounded unless you're still butthurt about him trading the clubhouse cancer OBJ.

Listening to other places, they made it seem like Thomas was number 4. If PFF had him rated number 1 that is good enough for me. They are the most trustworthy. My draft guide from Ourlads had him rated second. Soldier is a good guy but he sucks now. They can't have him play left tackle. If anything, they need to move him to right tackle if they play again. Looking at my guide, on paper there were some tremendous reaches. Should be a really good player available for us with our second pick. Personally, I think they should go center. However, if somebody like Delpit is there it would be hard to pass up unless they believe Love is their free safety. They also need another WR. Sheppard just misses too much time with concussions. I don't know how much longer he will play.

As far as Lamb to the Cowboys. When your QB is dumb, WR's don't make the difference. You don't want to be paying 3 WR's a lot of money. Personally, I think they are going to get rid of Prescott after this season.

Dump - largely agree with your approach to round 2, but with a couple of caveats. First, depending on how the first 3 picks in RD 2 go I would wait until end of 3rd for a C. There will still be some options then. I think Biadsz is going to keep slipping because of the shoulder/no combine workout. Hennessy is my top C and he might be gone, but there are a few others as well who project to day 1 starters.

If Gross-Matos is still on the board at 36 I think he is too good of a player and a fit to pass up. Been awhile since we’ve had a guy who can both play the run and rush the passer equally as well. He would be comfortable standing up in a 3-4 or with a hand on the ground in a 4-3. Add the fact that his PSU position coach is now on Judge’s staff. I have to think they’ve done a lot of homework on him. This defense lacks playmakers and GM spent a ton of time in the offense’s backfield past few years. He’s a disrupter. The Iowa DE is not as flashy but could be a safe pick at 36 for some defensive presence in the front 7.

The safety talent is definitely tempting. Delpit would be very hard to pass up as wold McKinney though he is more of a box safety. Love could be the FS of the future but he has never played there before. Corner at Notre Dame, box safety fill in for Peppers last year. But he looked to me like he had the range and tools to play the free as well. I’m sick of the trash we’ve been playing in center field past few years (Bethea, Curtis Riley). This team needs a ballhawk back there. Love could be it, and I’m willing to wait a bit on a safety for some more pass rush help. We are barren there.

If they go Winfield, it’s because they think he can bump between top safety and slot corner. Slot corner is another hole this team has.

If I’m a betting man, Gross-Matos is the pick if he’s on the board.

Yeah, I was thinking about Gross-Matos but we play the 3-4. I would rather have LB's with 4.5 speed and size in that system. I think it depends on whether they think Carter and Ximines are the answer there and will take a big step up.

Thought DG would go with a center but hard to pass on talent like McKinnon. Like Thomas another guy with the opportunity to step right in and start.

Here is my bottom line on all of this. If you took a large group of T rankings from ESPN, and NFL Network, and CBS Sports and averaged them out, Thomas was 4th. Now sure there were some places (or specific individuals) that ranked him 1st and maybe 2nd, but overall he was generally 4th when you did averages, and the larger # of individuals had him ranked 3rd or 4th of the 4. For example ESPN had 11 guys rank the 4 T's. 4 points for # 1, 3 points for # 2, and so on, and guess what...Thomas was 4th. There also was no other T taken until pick # 10. Again value?

With that said I am over it. It is what it is now. Like I mentioned, I do expect Thomas to be a solid player. The bust factor is very low. He is best suited to play LT now out of the 4. The Giants badly needed an upgrade at T, so huge need filled. Now I don't think he'll be the best or 2nd best OL taken of the big 4 in this draft, and he will not be # 4 pick worthy when the dust settles in a few years, but that doesn't matter now. Needed a T, took a T, and he was their preference (taken too early or not the highest rated is irrelevant now). They took the guy they had rated the highest, so we'll see how it pans out. For Giants fans sake I hope he is a Pro Bowl LT, which he needs to be in order to validate # 4.

My bigger focus now is Gettleman simply has to go. Having a GM like Gettleman in this day and age doesn't work. Today's world is fast paced. Being nimble. Trading up. Then quickly trading back. Packaging picks to move around and get certain players. MAXIMIZING VALUE. Gettleman does none of these things. He is a 1992 GM.

Just look at his picks. Not going to list them again, but it is clear he doesn't understand how to bounce around and be nimble in a draft. He takes positions too early (RB at # 2). He reaches for players who clearly can be had later (Jones & Thomas). I think it's because he is stubborn, falls in love with players and board/value be damned, and doesn't know how to be nimble enough to maneuver around a draft board.

This is what you get from a guy like Gettleman. Rigid and stuck in the past. The results have sucked. He says things, and then does the opposite, and it is not because he is smart and playing it close to the vest (OBJ trade/hog mollies - and there are other examples - for the record I liked the OBJ trade - that guy was a cancer and still is today). The guy is not made for today, and this is where owner loyalty hurts the Giants. Gettleman 100% should have been gone after this past season, but nope not in Mara's opinion.

I'm sure people will say I am wrong, and that's fine, these are all opinions, but results and the way he has handled the draft board (never traded down in his career) prove otherwise.

You're complete moron. His picks so far have been brilliant. His drafts have been tremendous. He took the number 1 and 10 rated tackles by pro football focus and the 2nd rated safety. Pro football focus is really one of two places you look to evaluate players. The opinions of the mental midgets covering the draft mean nothing. The OL sucked beyond belief. He added what should be a franchise left tackle, a very good safety and possibly an very good right tackle in Peart who is very talented. He might get his center in Biadasz if he falls today. So sick of assclown thinking like yours that the game is played differently now. Fucking stupid thinking and total bullshit. The teams that win SuperBowls basically every year have high IQ, pocket passing QB's, very good OL's and big physical defenses. Spoiled, asswipe Giants fan are complaining about a GM who took just 2 years to take you from one franchise QB to another when some teams have been looking for a franchise QB for decades.

This team had nothing when Gettleman got here. No RB, no QB, no DL, no OL, no secondary and crappy special teams. Yet, local asswipe media and fans think he would fix it in a year or two. Get a clue. Idiots like Lamar Jackson are all the same. They run, wow people into thinking the game is different then they get their leg bent the wrong way and they turn into half ass schmucks. The game is the same as it always has been.

" ESPN, and NFL Network, and CBS Sports and averaged them out, Thomas was 4th"

This is why you have no clue. All those above are full of dumb fucks who know nothing about evaluating talent. The only two things to look at are Pro Football Focus and Ourlads scouting services. Looking anywhere else is beyond stupid.